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Canadian vs Australian Preparation


Paddy

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I am not an expert on Australian soccer, but they seem to be a country in a very similar circumstance to Canada. They are geographically isolated, many of their top players play in Europe and many players raised in Australia have left to play for other countries.

It would seem though that Australia is able to put a better product on the field. If not for having to qualify via Oceania, I think they would have been in the WC more frequently. They have had their lulls in internationals, but overall they seem to play more friendlies than Canada (http://www.ozfootball.net/ark/Socceroo/Socceroo.html) and have had excellent results in Confederation Cups ( a 3rd and second place finish) and have been in the last 5 Olympics, with a 4th place finish in 1992. I don't have the time to investigate each squad in each game, but I would assume that they are playing a mixed squad quite often for friendlies. I still think getting players experience is valuable whether they are A or B team caliber.

They do have a national league, though I doubt it is at the level of the MLS, probably closer to the A-League. I have also heard that they have a good youth system (academies) as well.

Now considering all this...is there anything the CSA could learn from Australia? I fail to see how we cannot match Australia as I would think they have more going against them than Canada. It does seem though that Australians get behind their teams more than in Canada. The weather may also be a factor, but still, we should be at least on par with this country.

Thoughts appreciated.

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didn't the aussie soccer association disband, and was reformed as a federation, headed by some shopping mall billionaire? i say this repeatedly, canada needs to separate the mens program, and run it more like a private football club. more aggressive business structure, less community based.

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The problem with the Australians is that they are not "realistic" consequently they can not take advantage of an orderly and incremental advance from incompetence towards mediocrity. Silly buggers...how can one enjoy success unless one has had to wait an eternity to achieve it?

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quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

Australia played on March 24th and then they didn't play again until June 2. Why aren't they preparing better?

Hmm…not sure if you are being facetious or not. I was thinking more of how a nation like Australia is able to compete at a higher level than Canada when they have the same problems when it comes to international games. It appears that they play more (they will have had 9 games since last years WC including 5 this year before the Asian Championships starting in July) and have a better domestic infrastructure. I am, as I said, not 100% on this, but I have often thought that they must be doing something better or different than Canada as they have had some very impressive results in the past 10 years. It may warrant investigation since people are wondering what Canada can do to improve its situation. If an isolated nation with a smaller population than Canada can do it, so can we.

This page is quite interesting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia_national_football_team

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I'm pretty sure they hold a lot of their camps in England and have a training facility there. They also play friendlies in London against teams other than England ;)

I've been saying for years that Canada should take that approach when it comes to getting our guys together on a more consistant basis.

Set up shop in London, have training camps on international days when a match can't be set up. And play a bunch of friendlies over in Europe, then come back home during the summer and play on our side of the pond.

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quote:Originally posted by Paddy

Hmm…not sure if you are being facetious or not.

I am.

If you notice, the Argentina game has been canceled. (It will now be played in September, so it doesn't count as a Asian Cup prep game).

The other important thing to note is that Australia only plays during FIFA dates. Mind you a big debate started in the Can-Ven thread about Canada's lack of prep. But Canada's prep is similar to Australia's in 2007. Most of the posters come in their pants when the issue of Australia arises. But I personally don't get as excited. As we can see in the link, in 2007 at least, we will have just as much prep as Australia. Neither nation has anything scheduled past September. Really, other than joining the Asian Confed, what can we really learn from Australia?

The solution to Canada's problems is simple: preparation. That's it. All I ask for is the CSA to set up friendlies for the team. Unlike other posters on this forum, I actually believe Canada has the talent to qualify for the World Cup in CONCACAF.

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quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

The solution to Canada's problems is simple: preparation. That's it. All I ask for is the CSA to set up friendlies for the team. Unlike other posters on this forum, I actually believe Canada has the talent to qualify for the World Cup in CONCACAF.

I'm with you on that one.

We need more time together and more games, but more importantly we need someone at the helm who has a clue about how a team should play the game to succeed in CONCACAF.

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quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

I am.

If you notice, the Argentina game has been canceled. (It will now be played in September, so it doesn't count as a Asian Cup prep game).

The other important thing to note is that Australia only plays during FIFA dates. Mind you a big debate started in the Can-Ven thread about Canada's lack of prep. But Canada's prep is similar to Australia's in 2007. Most of the posters come in their pants when the issue of Australia arises. But I personally don't get as excited. As we can see in the link, in 2007 at least, we will have just as much prep as Australia. Neither nation has anything scheduled past September. Really, other than joining the Asian Confed, what can we really learn from Australia?

The solution to Canada's problems is simple: preparation. That's it. All I ask for is the CSA to set up friendlies for the team. Unlike other posters on this forum, I actually believe Canada has the talent to qualify for the World Cup in CONCACAF.

I didn't notice the Agentina game had been cancelled. They do still have one more prep game coming up against Singapore (not an Asian Cup Game). So, not to split hairs, that is still double the games that Canada has had this year. Canada should have had at least two games before the Gold Cup.

Anyway, I still think they are doing something better than Canada as thier results on the field speaks for itself.

Of course Canada has the talent to qualify from Concacaf, that has never been in question. What is in question is why we continually fail. I think we are on the same page here as I firmly believe it is preparation...especially more games.

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quote:Originally posted by Paddy

Canada should have had at least two games before the Gold Cup.

When would you schedule that second game before the GC? FIFA dates are june 2 and 6 and the team was only together on may 30 due to the players club schedule.

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There are a lot of posters on this forum that think 2010 is already lost.

The only thing that Australia did more than us this year was play in February. Including the June 30th Australia friendly isn't fair in the comparison.

We already have friendlies scheduled for August and September. As long as the CSA gets us a game in October and November as well, I'll be happy.

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quote:Originally posted by loyola

When would you schedule that second game before the GC? FIFA dates are june 2 and 6 and the team was only together on may 30 due to the players club schedule.

Do we play enough games?

Maybe things were tighter before this Gold Cup and we didn't have the flexiblity, but I still think there is obviously more that can be done. We need to arrange games and call the players that can make it. I see nothing wrong with maintaining a B team and/or just focusing our energies in Europe.

There was a time that existed before FIFA international dates, if I am not mistaken. Personally I dont think that just hitting FIFA dates will be enough.

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quote:Originally posted by Paddy

Do we play enough games?

Maybe things were tighter before this Gold Cup and we didn't have the flexiblity, but I still think there is obviously more that can be done. We need to arrange games and call the players that can make it. I see nothing wrong with maintaining a B team and/or just focusing our energies in Europe.

There was a time that existed before FIFA international dates, if I am not mistaken. Personally I dont think that just hitting FIFA dates will be enough.

You said we should've played one more game before the GC. I answered your affirmation. Don't come back to me with a "Do we play enough games". That's not the question, the question is about the feasibility of your affirmation.

You're talking about pre-GC friendlies. I assume those games are for the players that will be in the GC squad??? Was it possible to have another game, with those players, before the Venezuela game? The answer is no.

If you are talking about having another game with a different group of players you should remember the problems we had assembling the current group....

If FIFA dates are enough for Australia, they should be for Canada.

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quote:Originally posted by Paddy

Do we play enough games?

Maybe things were tighter before this Gold Cup and we didn't have the flexiblity, but I still think there is obviously more that can be done. We need to arrange games and call the players that can make it. I see nothing wrong with maintaining a B team and/or just focusing our energies in Europe.

There was a time that existed before FIFA international dates, if I am not mistaken. Personally I dont think that just hitting FIFA dates will be enough.

As loyala has clearly argued in other threads, its nearly impossible to get a team together on non-FIFA dates, except in December and January, when you can call guys from summer leagues (North America and Scandanavia). And even then some of them don't show up.

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quote:Originally posted by loyola

You said we should've played one more game before the GC. I answered your affirmation. Don't come back to me with a "Do we play enough games". That's not the question, the question is about the feasibility of your affirmation.

You're talking about pre-GC friendlies. I assume those games are for the players that will be in the GC squad??? Was it possible to have another game, with those players, before the Venezuela game? The answer is no.

If you are talking about having another game with a different group of players you should remember the problems we had assembling the current group....

What about June 3rd. Could that not have been a possibilty. Mexico is having a game 3 days before its first Gold Cup game.

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quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

Huh? You want Canada to play on June 1 and June 3? This isn't the USL Div.1

Why not. Find a weaker team for the next game. Get a local pro team. I have had to play in tournaments of 5 games over 3 days in plus 30 heat. I am sure they can play a second game with a days rest.

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quote:Originally posted by Paddy

Why not. Find a weaker team for the next game. Get a local pro team. I have had to play in tournaments of 5 games over 3 days in plus 30 heat. I am sure they can play a second game with a days rest.

That's just crazy. You're looking for injuries while suggesting that.

Did you notice that our guys needed time to practice the defense on set plays for example. Do you seriously think that we would best serve by beating St-Kitt's 5-0 instead of practicing???

If we played on June 1 and June 3, you can forget the June 2 and JUne 4 for practices purposes. That let you with only June 5 to have a light practice before the CR game. Plus all the travelling.

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quote:Originally posted by loyola

That's just crazy. You're looking for injuries while suggesting that.

Did you notice that our guys needed time to practice the defense on set plays for example. Do you seriously think that we would best serve by beating St-Kitt's 5-0 instead of practicing???

If we played on June 1 and June 3, you can forget the June 2 and JUne 4 for practices purposes. That let you with only June 5 to have a light practice before the CR game. Plus all the travelling.

Did we have to go as far as Venezula? Were there teams closer that we could have played that would have reduced the travel? I thought the it was a bit far to go just prior to the Gold Cup. If we had stayed closer there is a chance that we could have had two games and had less travel time with the option of a light practice on the 5th. Could we not have arranged games against other Gold Cup teams within the states? Other teams do it. I still think 2 games in 3 days is not a big deal - if you select the right opponents.

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2 games in 3 days not a big deal, but what about 3 games in 6 days (or 5 games between june 1 and june 11).....most of our guys are coming back from long season in Europe, not the best way to prepare them for the GC, don't you think?

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quote:Originally posted by loyola

2 games in 3 days not a big deal, but what about 3 games in 6 days (or 5 games between june 1 and june 11).....most of our guys are coming back from long season in Europe, not the best way to prepare them for the GC, don't you think?

You asked for options and I suggested options. There would have be two days rest between our final prep games and our first GC game. Then there would be another 2 days rest before playing our second GC game. Also, it seems that the tournament organizers think a day between games is ok as there is only that between our 2 and 3 games.

Most of our team did not have what I would call a long season in Europe as most were not involved in the major competitions in Europe to any great extent. I also didn't think that many players were involved in local cup games either. I do not know the details of each individual players, but it seems for the most part that their seasons where comprised of mainly league games and that any extra games (Europe, local cup) required ended a long time ago.

I still don't buy this tired soccer player thing. You don't need that much time to recuperate. All they do is play soccer, they don't have day jobs. They play, practice and rest. As a player I was always sharpest at the end of the season and I would play on up to 3 different teams in a year as well as work and go to school. We will probably disagree on this, but oh well.

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quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

Well, Australia isn't doing what you suggest and you seem to love them.

Huh...you seem to have some anti-Australia agenda. I was initially drawing a comparison between two similar countries and trying to figure out why one has been more successful. For the most part the Aussies come off like Americans to me, but, as I said, their results speak for themselves. Anyway...they are playing two games before their continental tournament - still more than us. Try putting your personal politics aside and then address the issue of Australia.

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