Richard Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 Letter to Cathal Kelly, the Toronto Star May 17, 2007 - By Mike Mosher, Head Coach Men's Soccer, University of British Columbia Dear Mr Kelly, I happened upon your Toronto Star article on the web today concerning our new national soccer coach and was I shocked by your claim and headline that Dale Mitchell is the wrong person for the job of Canada’s Men’s National Team Coach. http://www.bcsoccerweb.com/articles-may/bcsw-may-17.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 I don't agree with everything in the Kelly article but this letter is far, far more misguided and written by someone whose "soccer knowledge is extremely limited" far more than Kelly's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadasBest Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 Not surprising. Mosher and Mitchell are part of the good 'ole boys network. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 Mosher is a cry baby. How ignorant and sucking to Mitchel can he be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Grizzly I don't agree with everything in the Kelly article but this letter is far, far more misguided and written by someone whose "soccer knowledge is extremely limited" far more than Kelly's. Mosher knows his soccer, no doubt about it. It's not because of this letter, but he's a respected coach at the College level and ws a decent players by canadian standard. I'm not gonna address all he said, but I agree with him when he's referring to Simoes legacy in Jamaican soccer (which is not much....). A lot of posters have suggested that Simoes would've brought canadian soccer in a new direction and leaving a legacy behind him, I think that's naive when you look at Simoes credentials (I,m not saying things wouldn't worked out, but it was not a 90% not even 40% IMO). It's sad that this forum is always using the "old boys network" argument when a former canadian players or a coach in Canada is talking. (this is a general comment). Of course Mosher knows Mitchell but he brings some interestings points in his letter and they're worth discussing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 I posted links to both on the Protest Letter Reaction page, http://www.canadian-soccer.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11963. Just to let folks know, CBC World Report should have a piece on the Mitchell hiring Friday morning (18th) I believe, we heard from Teddy Katz today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted May 17, 2007 Share Posted May 17, 2007 Legacy building is the task of the FA, their COO and technical director. The manager's job is to hunt the glory with his players. I'd say qualification for France '98 and defeating Japan is pretty much the pinnacle of Jamaican football history. Achievements which Canada cannot claim. Taking shots at Simoes' record is absolutely retarded. Especially coming from the UBC coach. I fully support Mitchell and think he is a better choice than Simoes, but come on, this article is ridiculous. And to be published Richard, of all people, with his humming and hawing about respect, family values, yada, yada, is a real bout of hypocrisy! I can hardly stand it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone Legacy building is the task of the FA, their COO and technical director. The manager's job is to hunt the glory with his players. I'd say qualification for France '98 and defeating Japan is pretty much the pinnacle of Jamaican football history. Achievements which Canada cannot claim. Taking shots at Simoes' record is absolutely retarded. Especially coming from the UBC coach. I fully support Mitchell and think he is a better choice than Simoes, but come on, this article is ridiculous. And to be published Richard, of all people, with his humming and hawing about respect, family values, yada, yada, is a real bout of hypocrisy! I can hardly stand it. Pretty much all the talks about hiring Simoes implied that he would be TD. I'm pretty sure Simoes is a good coach but when he left Jamaica (and if I'm not mistaken he was TD in Jamaica) what kind of legacy did he left? That was one of the arguments for hiring him "he will leave a legacy for Canadian soccer". BTW, I was all for hiring Simoes, just think the argument about his legacy is not the strongest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 " Mosher has 11 year of head coaching experience at UBC. His Thunderbirds have advanced to three national finals (1997, 2001, 2005), winning gold in 2005. Mosher was also an assistant coach for two years at UBC, helping the Thunderbirds capture a CIS title in 1994. During his own playing career, Mosher advanced to three CIAU tourneys (1989, 1990, 1991), captained the 1992 Canadian Olympic team and was a member of the 1995 Canadian team at the 1995 Universiade in Fukuoka, Japan. " http://www.cisport.ca/e/international/story_detail.cfm?id=640 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 18, 2007 Author Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone Legacy building is the task of the FA, their COO and technical director. The manager's job is to hunt the glory with his players. I'd say qualification for France '98 and defeating Japan is pretty much the pinnacle of Jamaican football history. Achievements which Canada cannot claim. Taking shots at Simoes' record is absolutely retarded. Especially coming from the UBC coach. I fully support Mitchell and think he is a better choice than Simoes, but come on, this article is ridiculous. And to be published Richard, of all people, with his humming and hawing about respect, family values, yada, yada, is a real bout of hypocrisy! I can hardly stand it. I don't proclaim to publish only that with which I agree, quite the contrary. If I want to express my personal views I will write a piece over my name as I have done on occasion. Would you expect me to censor what I publish? Your attitude is assinine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Richard I don't proclaim to publish only that with which I agree, quite the contrary. If I want to express my personal views I will write a piece over my name as I have done on occasion. Would you expect me to censor what I publish? Your attitude is assinine. I think Richard has demonstrated that one of the virtues of his site is its plurality. And that is good for all of us, as otherwise we would have soccer sites only pushing their own agendas. Since Richard posted both the Kelly piece and the reaction that seems fair. The only possible doubt I have, frankly, is that it was not a press clip you picked up from elsewhere, but one written specifically for the web. Thus the Mosher letter had to be approved by your webs' editors, n'est pas? Would you be as equally willing to publish a piece on how the BC Soccer Association boycotted the CSA president, led a campaign against Linford and Simoes, and was one of the key reasons why the coach most consider best suited was not hired, in favour of a local boy? In what was a rather shameless piece of near-sighted provincial lobbying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Richard I don't proclaim to publish only that with which I agree, quite the contrary. If I want to express my personal views I will write a piece over my name as I have done on occasion. Would you expect me to censor what I publish? Your attitude is assinine. Rich, I have to run, but we will meet again on this topic. Bring your sniper rifle, tough guy. Suffice it to say, you have debased your web zine by having an amateur comment on the creditial of a world cup tested manager. I'm glad people are defending Mitchell, I've done so myself on more than one occasion, but this type of rubbish makes him look bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadasBest Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Richard I don't proclaim to publish only that with which I agree, quite the contrary. If I want to express my personal views I will write a piece over my name as I have done on occasion. Would you expect me to censor what I publish? Your attitude is assinine. Simoes was technical director for Jamaica as well as coach. He was also Technical Director for Trinidad and Tobago in 2001 and 2002 and was key in helping develope their domestic program prior to the 2006 WC. Good on you for publishing the letter Richard. Although I think it's a complete waste of webspace, it is nonetheless one persons point of view and he's entitled to it. The only way the letter could have been better if he included some of the same quotes from the Davidson article. I say this again. If the women's program can hunt down one of the best women's coaches in the world, then why can't the men's program do the same?? Maybe we need some players to refuse to play for the team under the current conditions like Hooper did to the women's program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadasBest Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. Would you be as equally willing to publish a piece on how the BC Soccer Association boycotted the CSA president, led a campaign against Linford and Simoes, and was one of the key reasons why the coach most consider best suited was not hired, in favour of a local boy? In what was a rather shameless piece of near-sighted provincial lobbying? Well said Jeffrey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJB Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 "One begins to suspect that the CSA enjoys this mediocrity because it discourages annoying questions. Let us not mince words – what we have achieved on the international men's senior level over the last two decades has been a wretched and inexcusable failure. The men and women who control soccer in this country have run out of excuses. What we really need now are enough people to call them on it." I have no problem with the article the Kelly wrote. I felt that it was honest, and quite truthful. And I particularly like the end, as quoted above. Mr. Mosher's response was quite childish actually. I enjoyed it only for that reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 18, 2007 Author Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone Rich, I have to run, but we will meet again on this topic. Bring your sniper rifle, tough guy. Suffice it to say, you have debased your web zine by having an amateur comment on the creditial of a world cup tested manager. I'm glad people are defending Mitchell, I've done so myself on more than one occasion, but this type of rubbish makes him look bad. How does publishing a letter sent to the Toronto Star and copied to me - no matter what it says - debase The BC Soccer Web. It's source is attributed right in the header of the article. You'e trying to shoot the messenger because you don't like the message - seems there is plenty of that on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 18, 2007 Author Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. I think Richard has demonstrated that one of the virtues of his site is its plurality. And that is good for all of us, as otherwise we would have soccer sites only pushing their own agendas. Since Richard posted both the Kelly piece and the reaction that seems fair. The only possible doubt I have, frankly, is that it was not a press clip you picked up from elsewhere, but one written specifically for the web. Thus the Mosher letter had to be approved by your webs' editors, n'est pas? Would you be as equally willing to publish a piece on how the BC Soccer Association boycotted the CSA president, led a campaign against Linford and Simoes, and was one of the key reasons why the coach most consider best suited was not hired, in favour of a local boy? In what was a rather shameless piece of near-sighted provincial lobbying? No, it was not a 'press clip' and it was not made to look like one either. Why is that a problem, I publish directly submitted material quite frequently? Is this another case of shooting the messenger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 18, 2007 Author Share Posted May 18, 2007 Has it not occurred to any of you that Cathal Kelly perhaps set out deliberately to spark controversy? Seems he has succeeded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffymac1971 Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Richard, Good on ya for publishing this letter that Mosher sent to Kelly. Whether you agree or disagree with Motsher's postion, at least it is another opportunity for discussion of the incompetenices of the CSA. In my opinion, I agree that Simoes would have been the ultimate choice and should have been the only choice. Having said that, I like the appointment of Mitchell for the fact that core of the players trying to qualify for 2010 have played for him in in the past 2 youth World cups and the upcoming 2007 U20 world cup. Yes there is no question that the suits of the CSA are an sad but incomeptent bunch, but hopefully all the discussion in the papers lately will finally force the CSA to wake and smell the coffee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffymac1971 Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Richard, Good on ya for publishing this letter that Mosher sent to Kelly. Whether you agree or disagree with Motsher's postion, at least it is another opportunity for discussion of the incompetenices of the CSA. In my opinion, I agree that Simoes would have been the ultimate choice and should have been the only choice. Having said that, I like the appointment of Mitchell for the fact that core of the players trying to qualify for 2010 have played for him in in the past 2 youth World cups and the upcoming 2007 U20 world cup. Yes there is no question that the suits of the CSA are an sad but incomeptent bunch, but hopefully all the discussion in the papers lately will finally force the CSA to wake and smell the coffee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadasBest Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Richard Has it not occurred to any of you that Cathal Kelly perhaps set out deliberately to spark controversy? Seems he has succeeded. Once again. I sincerely applaud you for posting 2 sides of the story, regardless of your own opinion on the subject. I agree with your controversy assessment. This is too good to be true... A reporter in Canada writing controversial material about Canadian soccer! This is wonderful! Cathal Kelly can start inventing stuff for all I care. As the saying goes, Any press is good press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Rich, I apologise. I am shooting the messenger. But I know you're used to dodging those bullets. I do feel you could have found a more credible counter-point to the Kelly article. But whatever. Onward and upward. I'm optimistic Mitchell will see us through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 I would like to hear a comment from someone (anyone) to the question posed by Jeffrey... "Would you be as equally willing to publish a piece on how the BC Soccer Association boycotted the CSA president, led a campaign against Linford and Simoes, and was one of the key reasons why the coach most consider best suited was not hired, in favour of a local boy? In what was a rather shameless piece of near-sighted provincial lobbying?" What is the whole story here? Is this true? Do we have supporting facts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Richard is only publishing the editorials so I have no problem with that. If noone writes a good one that is not Richard's fault (unless he refuses to publish it as well). I think the problem is that Kelly's piece while directing some legitimately strong criticism at the CSA, criticizes them for mostly the wrong reasons and is too harsh on Mitchell. Unfortunately the reactionary piece from Mosher tries an even more illogical, unfair, personally insulting (to both Kelly and Simoes) and inaccurate approach. Some of his comments about Simoes are pretty close to slander in my opinion and completely lacking in proper research (which is one of his criticisms of Kelly's piece, ie. why doesn't he take the time and find out where his nickname came from before he makes fun of it and it becomes one of his main arguments). And how did he determine that the Canadian Yallop left the head coaching job because of the way the CSA was run (and not because of lack of success and a contract to coach David Beckham) yet Bates the foreigner left because he was a mercenary (and not because the various bodies he was supposed to report to failed to implement his recommendations)? If I remember correctly the only one of the two who stated at the time he left that it was because of CSA (in)actions was Bates (Yallop's comments came later after he received criticism for abandoning the team). Mosher's piece is a vicious attack column meant to promote his friends and attack any alternatives to them. The problem with Canadian soccer is not that people like Kelly are writing critical articles of the CSA that could be better reasoned but that the CSA and provincial bodies are being governed by small minded, provincial, amateur coaches like Moshes who have a political agenda and consider themselves to be far more knowledgeable about the game than they are. I have no problem with Moshes supporting Mitchell for coach or disagreeing with the Kelly article but the manner in which he did so is very distasteful and does not leave me with much respect for him as a person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 I wrote to Mosher personally. I was a bit hard on him, sorry to say, since I respect him as UBC coach, heard okay things about him. Richard, I did not know that the Mosher letter was sent originally to the Star in reaction. Since it had not been published, though, and was directed to them, you published it before its destination received it. Which does imply a privilege for the author and an editorial decison. In any case I won't make much of that, since I think you have perfectly well justified your position here, and anyone looking at the web can see it is very plural, lively and interesting. After all, you could have chosen not to publish the Kelly article. So cool, man, only I don't think you saying you just published it because it was copied to you means you renounced an editorial decision in doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.