loyola Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 BF is obviously not a WNT follower..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Regs The players in question apparently said they were committed to a recent trip (can't remember - did they just go to France?) but then never showed up for the flights which subsequently caused the CSA to eat the cost(s). The 3 in question also, apparently, are not exactly 'in tune' with their (former) teammates. My source is within a CSA national program but certainly doesn't think much of those at the top of the association. But it seems this little exercise is not to be hung on their heads. I'd give a big F U to these women if they did that as well. Why don't you read today's Globe and Mail article before you start maligning these three women who are all veterans and have paid big dues for the national team. They were very clearly told to move to Vancouver or else. PFO yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanderingwilbur Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Where do i start here? Im sure that Greg Kerfoot was not trying to create a national whitecaps team. A person must love soccer to run any organization, as im sure there is little to no money in it. For Years he has had many national level players on his teams(mens and womens) that he paid even if he was lucky to see them a few times during an entire summer due to Canadian commitments.Im sure those players are very thankful for his support. Kerfoot is either one of the greatest backers in Canadian soccer or nuts.He has offered hunderds of thousands of dollars to help these ladies as they prepare for the world cup which he could not hope to make back even with a national whitecaps team. Thank God there are people like him in a financial positon that cares to support our nation teams. Please remember the time spent in training for these events can almost make it impossible for for any playing commitments to other teams. A lot of these ladies need to survive( make a living to pay the bills) and God knows the the money they get from the CSA or(government) barely cuts it for any pro athlete. If any player can make a little more anywhere( Europe, Asia ,USA) you cant blame them even during world cup Qualifying.If you could make $35.000 a year instead of $25.000 doing something you enjoy at the highest level you could find, wouldnt you? This is in no means a cut against what the CSA or Kerfoot is doing with the Vancouver Camp; Vancouver is the closest thing no the best spot to train as can be found( for both facilities and players). The US orginization has also had its financial battles with its players recently(both Mens and Womens)and im quite sure they are doing a hell of a lot better financialy then our players here. This is the main thing i want to say in this long jumbled rant.IF Charmaine Hooper and others had not stood up for themselves and the state of Canadian Womens soccer in 99 where would the team and younger players be now and would there be so many girls playing soccer in Canada?. Would there be as large of a budget( its not great but amazing compared to the 90s), as many games played each year? or would they have gone out and hired a worldclass coach? I know womens soccer has changed a ton in the last 10-15 years and im not saying anything bad about the previous coaches(as they could only do with what support they were given)but the womens program was undereverything(ie Stupid) and Hooper and the others were right to do what they did. They were given a nothing budget, played maybe a few times a year and had a 2 week camp before qualifying. The teams would then lose to nobodys they should have trumped. If im Charmaine Hooper back then and had played at the highest levels in the US and Japan i would seriously be pissed. She is a competitor, leader and voice of this team and has, will stand up when she feels wronged. There is no way any of the players( hooper, Latham and Nonen) should go out like this, they are not trouble makers! Can any of us truly understand the finacial and time commitments/Sacrifices they made to play for Canada? Going back to the friendly in July against the USA. Charmaine was upset because she wanted to beat the USA, how can you have a chance when a bunch of the team regulars are not even called up. Hooper and Lablanc are very important figures on thier teams. They missed an important playoff game,and probily felt they let thier team down for a non serious game while four others were able to play. Wouldnt you you feel upset? especially if you are Lablanc and didnt even play in the game. Thats BULL. Those league teams are paying thier salaries. How could one team be spared releasing ALL 4 players even with 6 months notice( could they even know about this game or camp then?). How were the other teams supposed to know that they would have a playoff game 6 months piror at the same time? and How the hell did this situation get so stupid? Oh yes its the pride and stupidity of the ones in charge. For the Love of God would all parties sit down and work out these problems and any misunderstandings? Its Sad:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I think that Kerfoot had good intentions in funding this program and it wasn't an attempt to turn the Whitecaps into Team Canada. The unfortunate thing is maybe he and other wealthy supporters will think twice if their funding efforts are mismanaged and lead to their names being dragged through the mud. The blame lies with how things were carried out particularly by the coaching staff. There does seem to be some attempt on the part of the coaching staff to manipulate the teams and results of W-league. I was hoping for the Fury being from Ottawa but that was bull**** that they got to keep their players while other teams had to release them. The following article's Andrea Neil quotes does not support Regs contention that these three players are disliked by the rest of the team. Controversy in soccer camp By BOB MACKIN -- 24 Hours Vancouver Canada's national women's soccer team is training in Burnaby this week under cloudy skies and clouds of controversy. Charmaine Hooper, who played in Canada's first women's international match in 1986, Christine Latham and Sharolta Nonen were suspended for not reporting to August's matches versus China in St. John's, Nfld. They were cut from the Canadian Soccer Association's Vancouver-based residency program funded by Whitecaps' owner Greg Kerfoot, who is paying players $20,000 a year. The trio then hired a lawyer. So did the CSA, which refuses to comment. Canada will play in South Korea's Peace Queen Cup friendly tournament and the Women's Gold Cup without the trio. Canada needs to win the Nov. 22 Gold Cup semifinal to qualify for 2007's Women's World Cup in China. "It's very unfortunate. Those are three huge players for the team," said midfielder Andrea Neil. "The team also has to move on and prepare for qualifying for another World Cup. It's a team decision." Neil, a veteran since 1991, expects FIFA world player of the year nominee Christine Sinclair to captain Canada this fall. Hooper told Canadian Press wire service that she would not play again for head coach Even Pellerud. She has been irate since a July 30 friendly against the United States. Pellerud selected Hooper and Karina LeBlanc from the W-League's New Jersey Wildcats, but didn't choose any Ottawa Fury players. Goalkeeper LeBlanc was not used in the U.S. game, which was played the same day the Fury upset New Jersey in the Eastern conference final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I don't see a lot in this quote from Neil. I'm not expecting any player to take a shot in the newspapers at the 3 and I would be very surprise to hear about players publicly supporting the 3. It's a very unfortunate situation and I'm wondering what really happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regs Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Ed, Clearly. What was I thinking listening to an insider rather than some media hack who couldn't give 2 tosses about soccer in Canada unless there was some sort of sensationalism to report? Grizzly, "It's very unfortunate. Those are three huge players for the team," said midfielder Andrea Neil. "The team also has to move on and prepare for qualifying for another World Cup. It's a team decision." - To me, that reads the trio are not "in tune" with their (former) teammates... almost as if there perhaps was a vote... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I think by their very actions these three players have forfeited their future with the national team program. Hooper in particular has been behaving in an unacceptable fashion lately when it comes to the WNT program. There is no way there could be any peace, harmony and singleminded purpose in the WNT camp now if these three ever came back. Good riddance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Wonder whether Hooper will have the grace to decline RONA's money now that she is no longer a member of the WNT, somehow I doubt it. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20061018.AMNOTEBOOK18-1/TPStory/Sports Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I have a lot of respect for Charmaine Hooper. She's been a top player for Canada for 20 years, capped well over 100 times. She is the face of Cdn soccer to the world. She is a married woman and a mother and I would be hard-pressed to see why she should be forced to be in a residency program with the national team. Surely the CSA could have come to some arrangement with her so that her home life and career in the States is not severely affected just to prepare for her 3rd World Cup. She's made the CSA blink before and I'm in her corner to the end. I don't know much about Nonen but I do know plenty about Christine Latham. She's a fine young woman and another role model for young girls in Canada. The fact that these three have left the program and sued the CSA demands attention, whether it be from a hack with passing interest in the game or from someone who has closely followed our national teams for years. On the other hand, I know nothing about Regs and Richard, other than their obvious interest in the game running websites promoting the sport in BC and beyond. But for the two of you to so blithely tell those women to go to hell has provided a better picture of you both. I am continually amazed and grateful for the generosity of Mr. Kerfoot in regards to developing the game in this country but heaven help us if such women as these three are barred from representing the country. It certainly looks like the CSA has turned another gift horse into a royal screw-up, just as they came so close to doing with the $35 million sitting on a plate for the national stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
near_post Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Richard I think by their very actions these three players have forfeited their future with the national team program. Hooper in particular has been behaving in an unacceptable fashion lately when it comes to the WNT program. There is no way there could be any peace, harmony and singleminded purpose in the WNT camp now if these three ever came back. Good riddance. What is it that you don't get, Richard? These players, among Canada's best, have simply blown the whistle on deceit and heavy-handedness from the very folks who should have been in their corner all along as advocates. They have done a service *for* their teammates and for those that come after. It is not the first time this has happened. Try to be fair. You may not like it that the power equation has been reversed, but it has happened appropriately, instigated by a courageous trio and a captain who stands head and shoulders above the rest, as she always has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Maybe that is the way its done in Norway, just go around screwing other teams. To ask Christine Latham to break her contract and screw her Atlanta team is purely wrong. And then threaten her with cutting of funding is simple extortion. Pellerud has got to go. I think between Neil and Hooper they can coach the team to good success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 "These players, among Canada's best, have simply blown the whistle on deceit and heavy-handedness from the very folks who should have been in their corner all along as advocates." Upon what facts is such a conclusion drawn? The only 'facts' we have are that legal action has been threatened by Hooper and crew because their funding has been suspended. I have no wish to put down these three players' abilities on the field of play or their accumulated statistics but it seems to me this is all about money and not a result of any supposed loyalty to the national program. If it really was about the team the last thing they would have done was sue because of the inevitable impact it would have and has had on their team mates, the women's game in Canada and their own reputations. Hooper and the others are no doubt sore that through their own actions they have lost their CSA carding money (up to $1,500 per month) and the $20,000 a year from Kerfoot's fund, totalling a possible $38,000 per year. Frankly it strikes me Charmaine Hooper has got just a little too big for her boots and she has dragged the other two down with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regs Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Special Ed On the other hand, I know nothing about Regs and Richard, other than their obvious interest in the game running websites promoting the sport in BC and beyond. But for the two of you to so blithely tell those women to go to hell has provided a better picture of you both. Try reading what I wrote a little more closely. Then re-read it again. Eventually it will sink in that (1) I am relaying some 'insider' info; and (2) I said IF these women did stiff the CSA outta cash and had the team scrambling at the last minute, I would give them a big F U. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJB Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I'm not certain what to make of this to be honest. I mean, Charmaine Hooper has been a servant to the National Team for a long time, even playing defence for the last World Cup, so it makes me confused. Who to trust? I doubt that Kerfoot would set up this program for the benefit of his Whitecaps, but I also doubt that Hooper would just make this up. What we're missing here is that the program is in trouble. At the heart of that, in my opinion, is the fact that we play ugly soccer; kick and run. Players that have skill are not be asked to use it, and instead we are playing people like Kara Lang, who is just a big, awkward player with a name. We have the players to play good ball, but Coach Evan isn't playing that way. Instead, he's sticking to what worked for him in 1995, and hasn't evolved with the women's game, and it has come a long, long way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJB Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I'm not certain what to make of this to be honest. I mean, Charmaine Hooper has been a servant to the National Team for a long time, even playing defence for the last World Cup, so it makes me confused. Who to trust? I doubt that Kerfoot would set up this program for the benefit of his Whitecaps, but I also doubt that Hooper would just make this up. What we're missing here is that the program is in trouble. At the heart of that, in my opinion, is the fact that we play ugly soccer; kick and run. Players that have skill are not be asked to use it, and instead we are playing people like Kara Lang, who is just a big, awkward player with a name. We have the players to play good ball, but Coach Evan isn't playing that way. Instead, he's sticking to what worked for him in 1995, and hasn't evolved with the women's game, and it has come a long, long way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
near_post Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Richard Frankly it strikes me Charmaine Hooper has got just a little too big for her boots and she has dragged the other two down with her. What a crock ... Open your eyes, man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
near_post Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Richard Frankly it strikes me Charmaine Hooper has got just a little too big for her boots and she has dragged the other two down with her. What a crock ... Open your eyes, man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 It seems more and more that the blame for this whole fiasco of any sort seems to land at the feet of the CSA only. Kerfoot has shown his willingness to be a private investor in the women's national team. Only one could wish that he provides similar assistance to other parts of the national program. He's kept the Whitecaps team afloat and is making plans for the future. The only fault I find with him was to offer Pellerud and leaving even a trace of an ethical breech. As for the players, they have rather good beefs to deal with. The girls have lives already set up and that they aren't expected to drop everything for an extended period of time (Especially from the WWC to the Olympics) and yet not get any damn answers on what is going to happen and what's expected of them. These players are veterans that still provide leadership which is lacking. Now to the CSA.... 1) Kevin Pipe knew that Kerfoot was a private man and that there was going to be no massive public announcement with all the bells and whistles. There shouldn't have been one to begin with. It seems that Pipe feels the most sucessful way is to extravagant and spend huge amounts of money is the best way. 2) Pellerud and the CSA were never clear that should the players be playing for the Whitecaps was a condition of the money. This is certainly the hope of P&P to have the national team playing together on the Whitecaps to sell it as the mecca for women's soccer. Pellerud has only been sucessful in making it more hard for people to involved in women's soccer. What's the point of having a women's team in any Canadian when you know the CSA is going to do what it can to take their best players away. 3) A poor lack of communication from the CSA in the whole issue of the program. No information about what the program is about or what is expected of the players who are a part of the program to begin with. Seems poor administration is a hallmark of the CSA's day-to-day operations. Seems that the CSA is going to waste more time and resources having to fight a legal case that their certainly to come out as the loser. To make matters worse, it's going to affect the team down the road at the WWC and during the Olympic qualifications, where we saw the first cracks emerging from this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Observer Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 To me, Pellerud should be sacked for his email exchange with Latham if it is true. It seems clear that he is putting enormous pressure on one of his players to break a contract and play in Vancouver. Frankly, that is out of order. Kerfoot is seemingly being a good samaritan and funding the program and unaware of that. Possibly the Whitecaps as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by An Observer To me, Pellerud should be sacked for his email exchange with Latham if it is true. It seems clear that he is putting enormous pressure on one of his players to break a contract and play in Vancouver. Frankly, that is out of order. Kerfoot is seemingly being a good samaritan and funding the program and unaware of that. Possibly the Whitecaps as well. Agree, I don't like what I saw in those e-mails, It's innapropriate for a NT coach to do that. It seems that Bobby L. was aware of what was going on. Anyone knows who are the CSA lawyers? I'm just curious about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by near_post What a crock ... Open your eyes, man. You're welcome to your opinion because that's all any of us can have in the absence of hard facts as they pertain to this saga. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I still support these three great players and condemn those in charge. The article from the Toronto Star today and the write-up from Charmaine herself in her website are pretty telling facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I haven't read anything about the suspensions on Hooper's website, are you referring to the USA game comments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepatriot Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Mallet's article paints a very different picture on why the girls were suspended and it was not because they did not turn up for a friendly as the CSA has said. Good for the girls for sticking to their guns. E-mail trail points to Pellerud, players say Latham pressured by coach to move to Vancouver or lose funding, messages reveal PETER MALLETT A series of e-mail exchanges between national women's soccer team coach Even Pellerud and veteran forward Christine Latham reveal the reason why Latham says she was pressured to join the Vancouver Whitecaps or lose $20,000 in funding. The revelation emerges one day after it was reported that three members of the national team, including Latham, were suspended by the Canadian Soccer Association because, the players allege, they are being punished for not committing to a residency program funded by Greg Kerfoot, the millionaire owner of the Whitecaps. The program pays 20 national team players each $20,000 a year. The money is in addition to funding that players receive from Sport Canada. "It's a big mess. We are all very disappointed," said national team captain Charmaine Hooper, 38, one of the three suspended players. "It didn't have to be like this." Bob Lenarduzzi, director of soccer operations for the Whitecaps, said in a report published yesterday that Kerfoot's interest in the national team does not interfere with his ownership of the W-League team. "They are totally independent," Lenarduzzi said. But e-mails obtained yesterday by The Globe and Mail paint a far different picture. "You must relocate to Vancouver in April and play 'W' here," Pellerud wrote to Latham in an e-mail on Feb. 1. It's believed that "W" refers to the W-League, the professional women's league of which the Whitecaps are a member. Latham had just signed a contract with a pro team in Atlanta. Pellerud wrote in an e-mail that she must break it. "It is no longer an option for you to go and play in Atlanta, even if that originally was your first choice. . . . As you know, Bob L in Whitecaps is trying to get hold of you, call him back immediately and feel free to negotiate a 'good deal' with him," Pellerud wrote. "Be smart." When Latham told Pellerud she had already signed the contract to play for the Atlanta Silverbacks, Pellerud told her to pull out -- and made it clear her funding was at risk if she did not. "Does not matter, this is not a discussion," Pellerud wrote. "Call them and pull back from commitment -- happens all the time in the soccer world. "I can tell you right now that your participation in the Full Time player program in jeopardy (20.000cnd/year) [sic]." When contacted yesterday, Pellerud said he was merely giving the 25-year-old forward advice on how to improve her development and have a more substantial role with the national team. "I said to her, you can get to the necessary level by making the changes and coming to residency. For me, it didn't make sense that she wasn't attending," Pellerud said in a telephone interview. "One of the allegations is that I pressured [national team players] to play for the Whitecaps. But this year the Whitecaps didn't sign any new players [from the national program]. There were no new signings. The proof was in the pudding." The third player suspended by the CSA is 28-year-old defender Sharolta Nonen. All three women have retained legal representatives. Kerfoot is private man who rarely speaks to the media. Lenarduzzi usually acts as the team's spokesman, but a Whitecaps spokesman said Lenarduzzi "has gone on two weeks vacation." The CSA's website says the organization "has been instructed not to make any further comments" by its legal counsel. The controversy comes as the national team prepares for World Cup qualifying, which begins Nov. 22 in Carson, Calif. In yesterday's report, CSA chief operating officer Kevan Pipe said there is no pressure for players to join the Whitecaps and the additional $20,000 in funding is not contingent on playing for the club, but there are currently 14 national team members on the Vancouver team's roster. "The e-mails speak for themselves," Hooper said yesterday. "[Pellerud] says it was all non-threatening -- but you can see the content of the e-mail." The three suspended players contend Pellerud is in a conflict of interest: If national team players live in Vancouver, Kerfoot gets access to top-level talent for the Whitecaps. Meanwhile, the national team program is able to keep its players in one location, making training simpler. Pellerud said in his phone interview yesterday that he rents a house from Kerfoot. "It's just a normal rental arrangement," Pellerud said. "They use me renting a house as an argument and they let down the team and they attack me. It doesn't make sense for me to want to put them back on the team." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 quote:Originally posted by loyola I haven't read anything about the suspensions on Hooper's website, are you referring to the USA game comments? try this http://www.charmainehooper.com/news.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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