Soccer at the EX: For Those Who Think Legal

[leekoo]

Soccer Stadium at Exhibition Place

The Policy and Finance Committee recommends that:

http://www.ontariosoccerweb.com/ost/viewtopic.php?t=1736

for your reading pleasure, it's all here (entire post) ... the meat is in C + E

Appendix “A”

Demonstration Plan

shows a routine map of exhibition place buildings

Appendix “B”

Site Plan

shows a routine map of the stadium site

Appendix “C”

Deloitte and Touche – Executive Summary Economic Impact Analysis

see below

Appendix “D”

Confidential Document – Letter of Intent

protects the privacy of the business interests

Appendix “E”

Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment Ltd. – Presentation to the October 19, 2005 meeting of the Board of Governors to come

[Massive Attack]

Thanks for that.

I guess for 'legal' reasons you won't be including Appendix D.

[Guest Dave]

Interesting how Bob McCown apparently claimed on his show last night that he knew what was in App D. I didn't hear it, but I think someone posted that this was what he claimed as his info source in claiming that, contrary to the main Report, the City would not retain ownership of the Stadium.

If McCown is correct, then the implication is that an Appendix to the Report 100% contradicts a clear statement made in the Report itself. That would be like if I signed an agreement to buy a house for $300,000, but later found a secret Appendix to the agreement that said the price was really $500,000. Of course, we all believe McClown, right?

[Gian-Luca]

Strange that there is a refernece to a WUSA franchise in the Deloitte report. Isn't there only the W-League now?

[Elias]

quote:Originally posted by Dave

Interesting how Bob McCown apparently claimed on his show last night that he knew what was in App D. I didn't hear it, but I think someone posted that this was what he claimed as his info source in claiming that, contrary to the main Report, the City would not retain ownership of the Stadium.

If McCown is correct, then the implication is that an Appendix to the Report 100% contradicts a clear statement made in the Report itself. That would be like if I signed an agreement to buy a house for $300,000, but later found a secret Appendix to the agreement that said the price was really $500,000. Of course, we all believe McClown, right?

He did quote from Appendix D. Some anti-stadium person with access to it probably passed it along.

Problem is he doesn't understand the difference between ownership, and operating. They both start with o's.

The city will own 100% of the stadium and the land. MLSE will share 50-50 with the city the operating profits after expenses, blah, blah, blah. He doesn't understand the difference.

[Metro]

quote:Originally posted by Elias

He did quote from Appendix D. Some anti-stadium person with access to it probably passed it along.

Problem is he doesn't understand the difference between ownership, and operating. They both start with o's.

The city will own 100% of the stadium and the land. MLSE will share 50-50 with the city the operating profits after expenses, blah, blah, blah. He doesn't understand the difference.

Someone should tell him that MLSE will be a glorified property manager of the stadium, not a co-owner.

[Massive Attack]

Here's what stands out from Appendix 'E', which was written by MLSE.

Stadium Minimum Specifications</u>

* Seating capacity of 20,000 with flexibility to increase to 30,000

* Will meet CSA, MLS and FIFA specifications and requirements

* A video scoreboard and a marquee "LED" sign visible from the Gardiner

* Premium seating areas consisting of 20 to 30 luxury viewing suites, 2 group areas and 500 club seats

* The stadium will have an artifical turf playing surface, an air supported winter structure allowing for use during the winter months and a covered canopy on the west grandstand of the stadium

* F&B Kiosks

* Merchandise Kiosks

* Team and community locker rooms

Stadium Event Programming</u>

* 16 to 20 MLS team games a year

* At least 6 CSA National Team games a year

* Will attempt to have the Toronto Lynx as a tenant

* Will attempt to have the Toronto Argos as a tenant

* Conservatively - 4 concerts a year

* Sigificant community access

* Featured events

- 2007 FIFA Youth World Championship

- 2008 MLS All-Star Game

- MLS Championship Game prior to 2012

Key Features of our CSA Partnership</u>

* Cross-selling of World Youth Cup 2007 tickets with inaugural MLS season seats

* Co-promote CSA national team(s)games at Exhibition Place stadium

* Work together in the community to develop the sport of soccer

* They are open-minded so increasing allowable foreign players on a team from 7 > 10 (phased out over time) to be competitive and marketable in the short-term, with long term goal of devloping star Canadian players

* Potentially share team staff

[Gian-Luca]

Notable from its absense is the distinction between men & women for those 6 national team games per year.

[Guest Dave]

While the notion of increasing allowable foreign players to 10 is a bit annoying (and unneccessary), I think the important point is that this still means 18 paying jobs for Canadians (including the developmental roster), some of whom will hopefully in time develop into senior players. Even if most of the Canadians aren't starters to begin with, this will still help bridge the gap for young local players with potential who don't catch on in Europe right away. It gives them a goal to shoot for, a confirmation that there is a future for young Canadians. My expectation is that MLSE will be pleasantly surprised at the level of Canadian talent, and within a year or so you'll see a starting roster largely composed of young Canadian talent that may have gone to waste otherwise.

[Andrew W]

quote:Originally posted by Dave

While the notion of increasing allowable foreign players to 10 is a bit annoying (and unneccessary), I think the important point is that this still means 18 paying jobs for Canadians (including the developmental roster), some of whom will hopefully in time develop into senior players. Even if most of the Canadians aren't starters to begin with, this will still help bridge the gap for young local players with potential who don't catch on in Europe right away. It gives them a goal to shoot for, a confirmation that there is a future for young Canadians. My expectation is that MLSE will be pleasantly surprised at the level of Canadian talent, and within a year or so you'll see a starting roster largely composed of young Canadian talent that may have gone to waste otherwise.

Well, it's interesting to note that proposed increase of foreign players. Seven is what current MLS rules dictate (four SIs, three YIs). The expansion teams last year also received an additional two YIs (for a two-year period) for a total of nine. What they're asking for is essentially what they'll likely be allowed by the league as an expansion team. Given that if two expansion teams are approved you'll likely see a league-wide increase in international player limits to accommodate the hit to the US player pool.

Now, whether or not they'll get a relaxation on the number of SIs is what would be interesting. At least with YI players, they can be traded and signed to developmental contracts. That said, they'll have to remember they'll be competing with the rest of the league and soccer world for international players. It's not like they'd be able to scrape up a team of international players that are going to make them better than the top teams in MLS.

Anyhoo, a stadium needs approval before any of this is even relevent.

[Gian-Luca]

Yeah, you're not going to need 10 foreigners to be competitive in the MLS. But I imagine that this is something their GM (whoever it will be) will be able to ascertain once he starts putting together a team. Or she I suppose - maybe they'll get Karen Brady.

[BusanBhoy]

"* Will attempt to have the Toronto Argos as a tenant"

WTF - this is not the first reference to the Argos Ive seen now. When did this stop being a FSS? Canadian Football dimentions CAN NOT fit in a FSS. Whats going on? I wouldn't have called my Counciler if this is just another multi purpose. Anyone know where the truth lies? That phonecall cost me $6, ill be pissed if it was a waste of money.

[Elias]

quote:Originally posted by BusanBhoy

"* Will attempt to have the Toronto Argos as a tenant"

WTF - this is not the first reference to the Argos Ive seen now. When did this stop being a FSS? Canadian Football dimentions CAN NOT fit in a FSS. Whats going on? I wouldn't have called my Counciler if this is just another multi purpose. Anyone know where the truth lies? That phonecall cost me $6, ill be pissed if it was a waste of money.

The widths are roughly the same no? Would need some space in the endzones, but I doubt there will be many seats (if any). Plus, politically, the potential of having 10 Argo dates with a "guarantee" of 20 000+ people sells a lot easier.

[Richard]

Would the Argos be interested in a 20,000 seat limit? The BC Lions have reportedly said (if we can believe them) they won't even look at a stadium that can't accommodate at least 30,000 expandable to 50,000 for Gray Cup events.

[Gian-Luca]

The stadium would be expandable to 30,000, so I think that is where there interest would come from.

Though unless MLSE buys them I don't see them leaving the Skydome anytime soon, but its a good angle to play for the politicians in any event.

[Richard]

MLSE are extremely unlikely to manage all the things they've undertaken to strive for but it did add a bullet point to the document :-)

[TOareaFan]

quote:Originally posted by Richard

Would the Argos be interested in a 20,000 seat limit? The BC Lions have reportedly said (if we can believe them) they won't even look at a stadium that can't accommodate at least 30,000 expandable to 50,000 for Gray Cup events.

Argos averaged over 30,000 a game this year and have a free rent deal at Rogers Centre....why would they move to a stadium with poorer access, pay rent and then turn away 10,000 fans each night?

BTW....Grey Cup

[RealGooner]

Good, we dont want the Argos at the ex anyway, so it works out nicely.

[Franky]

believe me, i've been to enough Argo games at the Teddy's center (formerly Lucy's-Dome). The Argo fans are a very passionate bunch and have a great tradition. this year with the new owners, there is such a buzz in Teddy's Centre (damn mosquitos!! hehe) they have dressed up the venue and created something amazing. i was in awe from the home opener and the festivities, to the excitement t/o the stade. i'm pretty sure the Argos are going to stay put and they have regained some respectability from quite a few football fans out there, ie 30,000 avg this year, wooooo, when is the last time they avg. over 30,000??? i can only think of 1991, anyone recall them avging over 30K from then on???

There is talk and a strong push to sell-out the dome for the Eastern Final, again that hasn't happen since the Argos pummelled the Blue Bombers in the '91 Eastern Final over 50K, i was there.

[dbailey62]

quote:Originally posted by Franky

believe me, i've been to enough Argo games at the Teddy's center (formerly Lucy's-Dome). The Argo fans are a very passionate bunch and have a great tradition. this year with the new owners, there is such a buzz in Teddy's Centre (damn mosquitos!! hehe) they have dressed up the venue and created something amazing. i was in awe from the home opener and the festivities, to the excitement t/o the stade. i'm pretty sure the Argos are going to stay put and they have regained some respectability from quite a few football fans out there, ie 30,000 avg this year, wooooo, when is the last time they avg. over 30,000??? i can only think of 1991, anyone recall them avging over 30K from then on???

There is talk and a strong push to sell-out the dome for the Eastern Final, again that hasn't happen since the Argos pummelled the Blue Bombers in the '91 Eastern Final over 50K, i was there.

Over 40k last night. I was once in a 52k crowd back at the Ex for a game against the Cats.

If they can keep up the momentum, the new stadium will be too small for them. If they were drawing only just over 20k, they could come and sell the place out and develop a "hot ticket" scenario but it seems they're doing just fine right now.

db