G-Man Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca I think that complainer the Sun devoted an entire article about is the same guy that wrote a letter to the Toronto Star about it. So by "not everybody" happy what they really mean is "One person in a city of millions is not happy, so lets go write an article about him and stir up more un-rest". Too bad the article didn't mention that the Ex board of Governors unanimously ignored him with their vote! But it was obviously a one-sided piece. Guess the author of which wasn't listening to the FAN590 yesterday either since he doesn't seem to have all the facts at his disposal. Including the name of the tournament to be held in Canada in 2007, apparently! I was against tax breaks for the NHL. I would also be against any public funds going to build a new NHL rink anywhere in Canada. And I'm not alone in this. People are fed up with bowing to pro sports and their bull**** ecomonics. This stadium should be built with private funds. AS there is a stadium in town that just fine for soccer and has already screwed the taxpayers of Ontario out about 400 million. I think they call it the Rogers Center now. The raping of the taxpayer continues.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote: MLSE jumps in with their hands on the ultimate "me too" market, Toronto Had to throw in the cheap shot. Jealousy is a b*tch isn't it? lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by G-Man This stadium should be built with private funds. The stadium is being built with private funds. If you meant to include the word "solely" in your sentence, if the stadium was built solely for private purposes & usage, you might have a point. But it isn't, so you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Change of tangent here, but are any of the GTA folks on here going to council on the 26th? An agenda should be easy to find so you can find out the time council will deal with the matter. Obviously this gentleman who was at the Ex board meeting will likely continue his crusade at the city council meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Change of tangent here, but are any of the GTA folks on here going to council on the 26th? An agenda should be easy to find so you can find out the time council will deal with the matter. Obviously this gentleman who was at the Ex board meeting will likely continue his crusade at the city council meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Andrew W Change of tangent here, but are any of the GTA folks on here going to council on the 26th? An agenda should be easy to find so you can find out the time council will deal with the matter. Obviously this gentleman who was at the Ex board meeting will likely continue his crusade at the city council meeting. Very important point here. This thing is not guaranteed by any means, and in my opinion is very important for the future development of Canadian soccer. I think it is very important that GTA Voyageurs attend this meeting of Council next week, and voice your opinion. In many ways it is just as important as attending MNT games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john tv Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 This is an excellent idea.I will put on my 20 year old Blizzard shirt on. It is somewhere in my basement as are all the other memories. I don't think the opposition is strong enough to defeat the passing of the extension of the funds. I just hope that there is not a smart councelor who can fillibuster this thing since time is of the essense even that day. I sincere hope that this time pro soccer is going to be a great succes and somebody is going to make a lot of money on our game. So far the record is no good.I guess there is this saying learning from your mistakes, well let us hope the media will this time burry the hatch and reconsider that we are talking about Canadian kids who should be able to play with the best of the world as have prooven time and time again that they can. The time will come and I hope in my life time that we will see a competitive game between a top European team and our boys in which we will dominate the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 When I see people like that Klaperski fellow, 'who is putting him up to this?' crosses my mind. Why is the Sun producing these shoddily written anti stadium pieces? Is there a connection between the two? Are there any interests who might feel threatened by another summer sport in Toronto? Especially one that might become very popular due to the hugely multicultural population? I'm not a conspiracy theorist and maybe Mr K is just an old guy with too much time on his hands and the Sun are just trying to sell papers with scare stories. However business and politics are both dirty affairs, and I tend to trust neither businessman nor politicians. So we have to be aware of possible attempts to manipulate opinion very subtly..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Observer Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I had to laugh at the Sun article...such bad journalism. They quote a length one guy who opposes the stadium, who represents nobody but himself....and as pointed out, they don't report the thing was approved unanimously. Whether you are for or against the stadium, that's just piss poor journalism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 How are things structured at Toronto City Council meetings? Is there an opportunity for taxpaying citizens to make presentations before a vote is taken? If so, are you required to give formal notice several days in advance in order to be permitted a 3 minute presentation or whatever? In my opinion it's incumbent upon our Toronto-area members to look into these sort of issues this week, and if possible to select someone to make a presentation on behalf of the Voyageurs, and the majority of Canadians who are supportive of our great sport. Don't let the myopic media, the baseball hacks, the local idiot politicians and the NIMBY crowd have their way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 At least one of the TO voyageurs should ask to speak to the issue at council and prepare a cognizant and respectfully presentation in favour of the proposal. Normally this can be arranged by contacting the City Clerk. There may be limits of various sorts, but I can bet that the opponents of the stadium will be trying to do the same. IN municipal politics, due in large part to low voter turn outs...the squeeky wheel gets the grease. It may be important to make sure that the anti-stadium crod are not the only "squeeks". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Assuming a TO-area Voyageur is able to do this, it's important to address the issue in a way that is relevant to your audience... simply supporting soccer won't do it, since many councillors probably don't give a rat's arse about soccer. I think the following points need to be included: 1. stress the WYC, rather than MLS. We don't want to be too closely allied with pro sports and big bucks. 2. soccer is the world's sport, and WYC is third biggest sporting event in the world (after Olympics and World Cup.) 3. financial and goodwill benefit to Toronto from WYC. Comparable in some respects to Olympics, at a fraction of the cost. 4. soccer is number one participation sport in Canada, especially among kids. "Do it for our kids", who love soccer and only need the chance to prove they can compete with the world's best. 5. Multicultural aspect of TO will make MLS much more likely to succeed than previous pro soccer in TO, since we have so many more immigrants now than in the past. 6. This is a cost effective and visionary investment of dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 Dave, that is a great starting point. And yes, we need to stress the WYC angle, because it I have noticed that the Anti-Stadium crowd are ignoring this entirely. Anyone know what time the meeting is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Man Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by RealGooner Dave, that is a great starting point. And yes, we need to stress the WYC angle, because it I have noticed that the Anti-Stadium crowd are ignoring this entirely. Anyone know what time the meeting is? Why build a new stadia for a youth cup, when the Rogers Center has hosted some of the biggest clubs in the world? I mean didn't the tax payer of Ontario pay over 300 million for that joint? Toronto has a decent stadium. But I like Dave's take "Do it for the Ethnic Kids" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by G-Man Why build a new stadia for a youth cup, when the Rogers Center has hosted some of the biggest clubs in the world? I mean didn't the tax payer of Ontario pay over 300 million for that joint? Toronto has a decent stadium. But I like Dave's take "Do it for the Ethnic Kids" What are you some kind of promotor for Ted Rogers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I just spoke to the City clerk's office. The lady there told me that City Council will meet at 9:30 AM Wednesday October 26. The public can attend, but cannot make deputations on behalf of motions being voted on. HOWEVER, the public may submit letters which can be distributed to the councillors. I understand that if the stadium is approved by Policy and Finance Committee (Who are meeting to vote on this now), they will submit it for vote on Wednesday. I was informed that we may contact the secretaries of P&F on Monday to arrange for any letters to be submitted for distribution on wednesday. Contact info for two secretaries for P&F: Patsy Morris, 416-392-9151 pmorris@toronto.ca Jeanette Gerrard, 416-392-6627 jgerrar@toronto.ca Policy and Finance Committee 10th floor, West Tower, City Hall Fax: 416-392-1879 They can make arrangements to have any letters from the public distributed to the council on the morning of the vote. Perhaps a letter can be submitted on behalf of Voyageurs posters in favour of the stadium? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Dave 1. stress the WYC, rather than MLS. We don't want to be too closely allied with pro sports and big bucks. Better said than done. Because the goal is the same year as the WYC, people will think the stadium is really for MLS. It isn't that hard to draw such a conclusion. quote:Originally posted by Dave 2. soccer is the world's sport, and WYC is third biggest sporting event in the world (after Olympics and World Cup.) Hard to sell it if TO doesn't get the major games of the tournament. Comparing it to the Olympics and the World Cup will be a sore spot for some on council who think their being given a lesser event. quote:Originally posted by Dave 3. financial and goodwill benefit to Toronto from WYC. Comparable in some respects to Olympics, at a fraction of the cost. Yet will the foreign tourists come or will we see a repeat of the '94 World Basketball Championships in which the Canadian flag is drowned out by the ethnic communities. quote:Originally posted by Dave 4. soccer is number one participation sport in Canada, especially among kids. "Do it for our kids", who love soccer and only need the chance to prove they can compete with the world's best. Then why would they need to spend it on a stadium for a pro team that would have little connection to the community. They would likely rather see the money spent on proper soccer parks for the kids to play in than on a stadium. Dallas would've gotten it's SSS earlier if they didn't have to deal with this question. quote:Originally posted by Dave 5. Multicultural aspect of TO will make MLS much more likely to succeed than previous pro soccer in TO, since we have so many more immigrants now than in the past. Muti-Culturalism is overrated. The only way that it works is not to force the people to accept the society they new live in and it's values. That means not forcing fans to watch Toronto MLS over Santos, Sporting Lisbon, Dynao Zagreb etc. You can try to assimilate them but that wouldn't be Canadian now wouldn't it? quote:Originally posted by Dave 6. This is a cost effective and visionary investment of dollars. That's what they said about Skydome. Look at the mess it created. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by RealGooner When I see people like that Klaperski fellow, 'who is putting him up to this?' crosses my mind. Why is the Sun producing these shoddily written anti stadium pieces? Is there a connection between the two? Are there any interests who might feel threatened by another summer sport in Toronto? Especially one that might become very popular due to the hugely multicultural population? I'm not a conspiracy theorist and maybe Mr K is just an old guy with too much time on his hands and the Sun are just trying to sell papers with scare stories. However business and politics are both dirty affairs, and I tend to trust neither businessman nor politicians. So we have to be aware of possible attempts to manipulate opinion very subtly..... You're looking for a connection? Look no further than Paul Godfrey, former bigwig of Sun Media who is now the president of the Blue Jays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Andrew W You're looking for a connection? Look no further than Paul Godfrey, former bigwig of Sun Media who is now the president of the Blue Jays. Thats what I was thinking, but didn't feel like bandying names about lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chet Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by RealGooner When I see people like that Klaperski fellow, 'who is putting him up to this?' crosses my mind. Why is the Sun producing these shoddily written anti stadium pieces? Is there a connection between the two? Are there any interests who might feel threatened by another summer sport in Toronto? Especially one that might become very popular due to the hugely multicultural population? I'm not a conspiracy theorist and maybe Mr K is just an old guy with too much time on his hands and the Sun are just trying to sell papers with scare stories. However business and politics are both dirty affairs, and I tend to trust neither businessman nor politicians. So we have to be aware of possible attempts to manipulate opinion very subtly..... Kasperski wrote a letter to the editor that was printed in the Sun a few days before McNulty's article. Some of the quotes are from that letter. The Sun usually edits letters to the editor pretty severely, so its possible all the quotes came from his letter. McNulty may not have even talked to the guy. I Googled Kasperski's name and guess what? He (or someone with the same name) is a drag racer. The stadium site is the current site of the Canadian Autosports Hall of Fame. Coincidence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zacRWE Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 So, is it looking good for the stadium now that the city council has voted for the stadium? now theres only one more vote, right? when it's built, it's Exhibition, right? thx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by zacRWE So, is it looking good for the stadium now that the city council has voted for the stadium? Where did you hear/read that? I've been looking for confirmation, haven't found it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealGooner Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 See my post above re: Planning and Finance Committee. They vote on it today, if it passes, it goes to City Council Wednesday morning 9:30 for a vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 I know they voted on it today, but Zac's post seem to indicate that the vote has already happened (given that its after 6pm in Toront I expect that as well)& was passed in favour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted October 20, 2005 Share Posted October 20, 2005 quote:Originally posted by RealGooner See my post above re: Planning and Finance Committee. They vote on it today, if it passes, it goes to City Council Wednesday morning 9:30 for a vote. Anyone know the history of Toronto council in terms of recommendations from their subcommittees? In many municipalities it is a rubber stamp situation, especially if the committee has unanimously approved the project and provided a fairly strong recommendation. I'd imagine a few of the tougher councillors in terms of doling out city dollars are already on this committee (as they usually are in most municipalities). If it squeaks by the finance committee and they have some reservations, it may be in for a rough ride with the full council. If they go for it in near unanimous fashion, it should make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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