Metro Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 Another Star article about Vaghan Mayor Michael Di Biase wishing to build the proposed Toronto stadium in his city: Vaughan wants to build soccer stadium City tries to save project scrapped by York U Venue would host FIFA's 2007 under-20 tourney GAIL SWAINSON STAFF REPORTER Vaughan is taking a serious look at building a soccer stadium on city land to replace the scrapped York University project, Mayor Michael Di Biase says, "We are really trying to save this," Di Biase said in an interview. "I'm prepared to do whatever it takes." Almost two weeks ago, York University cancelled plans to build a 20,000-seat soccer stadium. The stadium was to host the 2007 FIFA under-20 soccer championships, along with other cities across the country. It is the biggest soccer tournament ever held in Canada and the second largest held by FIFA, after the World Cup. Last week, Vaughan's committee of the whole endorsed a motion authorizing the city to meet with federal and provincial officials in the hopes of building a 15,000-seat venue. The politicians will request that $35 million in funding pledged to the York project be shifted to the Vaughan venue. City staff have also been asked to seek out potential funding partners in the private sector. The proposed stadium would be located at the Vaughan Grove Sports Park on Martin Grove Rd. south of Highway 7. The site, owned by the province but leased by the city for 99 years, has a small stadium and eight outdoor pitches used primarily by local teams. Vaughan politicians believe they can deliver a scaled-down soccer stadium on their own site using just the promised $35 million in government funding, Di Biase said. "We have to try. Greater Toronto just can't afford to lose this stadium or this tournament," he said. Earlier this month, the Toronto Argonauts pulled out of plans to build a $70 million, 25,000-seat stadium at York University. The federal and provincial governments had pledged $35 million in funding, the Argonauts were kicking in $20 million and the university $15 million. York would have owned the facility with the Argos managing and operating it. But the Canadian Football League announced that it had reached a deal to remain at the Rogers Centre. When the Argos pulled out of the deal, York looked instead at building a 20,000-seat stadium, to cost about $50 million. But on May 12, York announced it had shelved plans for the soccer stadium, saying it couldn't meet tight deadlines. Toronto, along with Edmonton, was to be a primary host for the 2007 tournament, a three-week, 24-nation, 52-match event for men from around the world under age 20. Ottawa, Montreal, Victoria and Vancouver are also hosts.Toronto, scheduled as headquarters for the tournament, would have had about a dozen matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john tv Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 Great idea which will work if the money is still around.Anyone who plays competive soccer or indoor soccer knows were the grounds are or will be.Close to many hwys and in the middle of a very succesfull and powerfull soccer community.I do remember suggesting to Mike 4 weeks he should consider this.At that time York was still in the running. Great news and one that will have some great impact for soccer in Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 It's gotten now to the point that I would rather that it not get built. I would rather see the taxpayers money be invested in manner that will yield better returns on investment. IMO, as far as location, size, and amenities it has been compromised down to a level that doesn't serve any purpose to canadian soccer on a macro scale. First it was 25K facility in downtown at U of T. That was close to perfect. Then, a major setback occurs when that location gets killed by political forces and prompting a relocation to an area outside the subway line up in the northern part of the city. That wasn't good, but at least it was still going to be a 20-25K seat facility. Then another setback, the Argos pull out and the talk becomes that the capacity will be reduced to 20K and amenities will be scaled down. At that point, I wasn't sure anymore. Now we are talking about a 15K facilility that is even further north and really out of the way since it is in the very upper northwest reaches of the GTA. And to boot, with a capacity of only 15,000!. I don't think you can commute to that location with public transit unless you plan a few days ahead of time. What's next after this project goes down the tubes? a 10K facility in Muskoka's cottage country? Who cares now? How is a prospective pro soccer operator going to benefit from a 15K facility in the middle of nowhere and where no one can get to unless willing to put up with dense traffic in car commute. As hard as it is to believe, getting up to that location would be more of an ordeal than getting to Centennial park. I would not be surprised to see even the Hartrells take a pass on that location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 Too little time for TO politics. They are months behind schedule at this point. What community in Canada wouldn't build the stadium with the gov't paying the entire ticket ? Other cities were told there was no gov't funding for their proposals. I'm sure Winnipeg Mayor Sam Katz would have jumped at the chance to have a stadium paid for by the federal gov't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Winnipeg Fury What community in Canada wouldn't build the stadium with the gov't paying the entire ticket ? Other cities were told there was no gov't funding for their proposals. I'm sure Winnipeg Mayor Sam Katz would have jumped at the chance to have a stadium paid for by the federal gov't. Perhaps, But I thought that Winnipeg did get a 10K facility ( paid for by Gov't $$$) for the Pan AM games that was eventually used by the Mens National team on two occasions in 2000. I suspect that with a few alterations (ie.: adding a few temp seats) here and there to that facility, you would have a venue that's a shoe-in to host one of the groups in 2007. Plus, They could have probably used that kind of venue for for other events such as mens and womens WCQ. Even the USL, I suspect, would be very pleased to hear of a partner with a relatively new 10K facility. But what ever happened to that venue? I heard here a while back that it got torn down. Its always been with the knowledge of the Winnipeg situation, why I have always felt that there is no point in going with anything of less than 20K and with infrastructures to serve other profit seeking ventures. Otherwise, someone will come along that will find it too easy to just tear it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 The World Cup final in Vaughan, Ontario. Gimme a break and give it up. Toronto will never be a big league soccer city. They can't even support Hartrells' FC Toronto Town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbailey62 Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Robert The World Cup final in Vaughan, Ontario. Gimme a break and give it up. Toronto will never be a big league soccer city. They can't even support Hartrells' FC Toronto Town. You've completely conradicted yourself. The reason Toronto doesn't support the Lynx is precisely because Toronto is a big league soccer city. Most soccer fans doesn't have time for the Lynx. db Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 It's unlikely that the gov't funds would be made available for the Vaughan idea without some private sector participation. Also, the fact that a university was in the original project also would have made it easier for gov't to contribute. As for the sarcastic remarks about Vaughan, it simply shows a lack of knowledge about Vaughan. Vaughan is to Toronto what Burnaby is to Vancouver. And given its growth rate, Vaughan likely has a larger population than Burnaby today. It seems most top level soccer games in the Vancouver area are played in Burnaby. So what's the difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Canuck Oranje It's unlikely that the gov't funds would be made available for the Vaughan idea without some private sector participation. Also, the fact that a university was in the original project also would have made it easier for gov't to contribute. As for the sarcastic remarks about Vaughan, it simply shows a lack of knowledge about Vaughan. Vaughan is to Toronto what Burnaby is to Vancouver. And given its growth rate, Vaughan likely has a larger population than Burnaby today. It seems most top level soccer games in the Vancouver area are played in Burnaby. So what's the difference? I don't know for sure, but it sounds like difference is that there's good transit to Swangard and it sits one crosswalk outside Vancouver, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 Walk across Steeles avenue from York University and you are in Vaughan. I don't want to advocate the location being proposed by the City of Vaughan but it isn't all that far from Toronto city limits. I don't know the transit links to the proposed location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ochico Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 I've already posted this on another board MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 ............and Gianluca already asked, please, give us some details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massive Attack Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 While I don't think the location is the greatest, if I had to chose between no stadium and a stadium in Vaughan, I would choose a stadium in Vaughan. The City of Toronto, U of T, the Argos, York U., and MLSE all had their chance to step up to the plate for this project. That is all in the past now. The thing that I find ironic is that the U of T and York U. are still both looking to build stadiums for their soccer/football teams. I'm sure $35 mil. of government funds could have come in handy for that construction. If U. of Windsor just spent about $15 mil to build a 4,000 seat stadium, I'd like to see what both of those schools can pull of with no public funding. As for Vaughan, contrary to popular belief, it's not in the middle of no-where. If you want to read more about it, check out what I wrote in the last Vaughan stadium thread. As for public transit, it does run in Vaughan. There are buses that will take you all the way to the subway. Sure, it takes a long time, but you will get there. To the best of my knowledge, the TTC, GO, York Region Transit and Brampton Transit all run in Vaughan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack While I don't think the location is the greatest, if I had to chose between no stadium and a stadium in Vaughan, I would choose a stadium in Vaughan. The City of Toronto, U of T, the Argos, York U., and MLSE all had their chance to step up to the plate for this project. That is all in the past now. The thing that I find ironic is that the U of T and York U. are still both looking to build stadiums for their soccer/football teams. I'm sure $35 mil. of government funds could have come in handy for that construction. If U. of Windsor just spent about $15 mil to build a 4,000 seat stadium, I'd like to see what both of those schools can pull of with no public funding. As for Vaughan, contrary to popular belief, it's not in the middle of no-where. If you want to read more about it, check out what I wrote in the last Vaughan stadium thread. As for public transit, it does run in Vaughan. There are buses that will take you all the way to the subway. Sure, it takes a long time, but you will get there. To the best of my knowledge, the TTC, GO, York Region Transit and Brampton Transit all run in Vaughan. Swangard as pointed out lies in Central Park on Boundry. Why do they call it Boundry? Right, because it is right on the Boundry of Vancouver and Burnaby. Why is Central Park called Central Park? Because it is located on a crest of land exactly at the midway point of the SkyTrain between downtown Vancouver and downtown New Westminster. It takes 15 minutes from either downtown by SkyTrain and an additional 10 minutes from the King George Station in Surrey. Trains run every two to three minutes. In your earlier post you mentioned that, “TTC does run in Vaughan, but you have to pay a seperate fair when you leave Toronto,” and “They are planning to have some kind of rapid busses on Hwy. 7 soon,” and “Also, there are a lot of major highways near the proposed site. Hwy 427 is about 5 mins away and Hwy 400 is about 10-15 mins. away (by car).” This all sounds like a great infrastructure for fans from around the world to come and expience, don’t it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Ivan ............and Gianluca already asked, please, give us some details. Indeed. I'd like to believe its true of course, but without any source presented or suggestion where the info is coming from, its difficult to get excited. Particularly since they have stated the opposite in the past, and that was when they had $35 million from the Government & $15 million from York to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massive Attack Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 Robert, I never stated that the Vaughan locaton was perfect. I have also previously stated that my preferred location for a stadium is Varsity. Maybe you should read the first sentence of my last post again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 The rumour came from a recent MLS broadcast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 quote:Originally posted by DoyleG The rumour came from a recent MLS broadcast. That may have come from a source who was not up date with the latest developments and may have be commenting based on news sources frm 4-5 months ago. Thats why I have to agree with GL, I do care for it if one cant produce a source or, if source needs to be confidential, then mention it. Otherwise, I am not interested in hearing about it. Thats how false rumour starts and leads to people just fabricating info. What good comes out of that? Would it have been so hard to say: " I heard/read on XXXXX yesterday that MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise ". Then we can judge for ourselves on the credibility of the source. OR, I'd even settle for something like: " I heard from a friend/family member/neighbor/guy on a bar stool involved in XXXXX that MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise". Again, we would be able to judge for ourselves on credibility of the source. But to just say: "MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise". Personally, I tend to view that in the same fashion as trolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Free kick That may have come from a source who was not up date with the latest developments and may have be commenting based on news sources frm 4-5 months ago. Thats why I have to agree with GL, I do care for it if one cant produce a source or, if source needs to be confidential, then mention it. Otherwise, I am not interested in hearing about it. Thats how false rumour starts and leads to people just fabricating info. What good comes out of that? Would it have been so hard to say: " I heard/read on XXXXX yesterday that MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise ". Then we can judge for ourselves on the credibility of the source. OR, I'd even settle for something like: " I heard from a friend/family member/neighbor/guy on a bar stool involved in XXXXX that MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise". Again, we would be able to judge for ourselves on credibility of the source. But to just say: "MLSE is ready to invest in a stadium for a MLS franchise". Personally, I tend to view that in the same fashion as trolling. A few people on BigSoccer have quoted (paraphrased) Rob Stone as saying that the MLS board of governors are holding meetings in June with MLSE and the San Antonio people, and one of the issues that will be discussed is MLSE's apparent interest in building a stadium on its own for a new franchise. It's all hearsay at this point, although it does not sound like old information. Take that for whatever its worth. EDIT: Here's the thread where these rumours started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Free kick Perhaps, But I thought that Winnipeg did get a 10K facility ( paid for by Gov't $$$) for the Pan AM games that was eventually used by the Mens National team on two occasions in 2000. I suspect that with a few alterations (ie.: adding a few temp seats) here and there to that facility, you would have a venue that's a shoe-in to host one of the groups in 2007. Plus, They could have probably used that kind of venue for for other events such as mens and womens WCQ. Even the USL, I suspect, would be very pleased to hear of a partner with a relatively new 10K facility. But what ever happened to that venue? I heard here a while back that it got torn down. Its always been with the knowledge of the Winnipeg situation, why I have always felt that there is no point in going with anything of less than 20K and with infrastructures to serve other profit seeking ventures. Otherwise, someone will come along that will find it too easy to just tear it down. The Winnipeg Soccer Complex was in existence years before the Pan-Am games, they simply added temporary seating that was taken from other municipal sites. Over the last two years, the WSC has fallen into complete disrepair and has not been used once. The land is now extremely valuable and the city wants to sell the site. Because of that, it has fallen by the wayside and been completely ignored by the city, thus creating the arguement that since it can't be used for soccer, it may as well be sold. The mayor states that he wants to build a new facility, but frankly I don't believe him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 Seems that the stadium is getting smaller with each proposal. Taking bets on when it will drop to 10,000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 quote:Originally posted by DoyleG Seems that the stadium is getting smaller with each proposal. Taking bets on when it will drop to 10,000. Wasn't it 13.5k in the first article, and now it's 15k? The seating capacity hinges on the (extremely slim) possibility of MLSE stepping in and taking over operating/building costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john tv Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 It seems to me ,being a 42 year old season ticket holder with the Leafs that 15000 is quite sufficient.Everything else is a matter of getting this thing done and in Vaughn, the most pro soccer city in Canada.It will work and will put Vaughn on the world map and as such may even attract industries they are promoting so much and guess what the guy is a soccer guy. Nice trolling eh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 Please guys, it is spelled VAUGHAN.... http://www.city.vaughan.on.ca/vaughan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john tv Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 quote:Originally posted by Richard Please guys, it is spelled VAUGHAN.... http://www.city.vaughan.on.ca/vaughan Richard this was a typing error not a spelling error. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I forgot to point out that in Vaughan we have the Soccer Center which is a full size domed soccer field,which is busy every day of the year. Financially this center is a great success. This center also houses Canada's Soccer Hall Of Fame as well as being a training center for Canada's national team.It also houses the CPSL. The various soccer clubs in the area represent the real powerhouses in soccer in Ontario.If I am not mistaken Paul Stalteri was playing for one of the local teams while many others have represented their clubs in the various National championships. Vaughan is also known for their very rich neighborhoods and mostly Canadians of Italian descent as well as many second and third generation very succesfull Canadians of Italian descent. I really believe that this would be more than an excellent choice and also well deserved. The support will be tremendous. It's a natural! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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