soccerbeast Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 With all the current mess the national side is in, why not close shop for a year or two skipping next years gold cup.By doing this the CSA can take a full look at where the team is headed. and the manager, who ever he is can travel to countries where our top players are playing and really give them the once over to see if they are in his plans or not. This would also give the U-20 players a chance to make the team and give us a better player pool then we had this wcq campaign. If sure the diehards who resist change won't agree that this might be the best way forward, but we are ranked in the low 90's on FIFA's list in can't be any worse if we closed up the shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loud Mouth Soup Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Haven't you already posted this insanity? Give it a rest, would you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerbeast Posted November 2, 2004 Author Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Loud Mouth Soup Haven't you already posted this insanity? Give it a rest, would you? No this is the first on this topic, and whats wrong with reorganizing the national side? Do you want it to get better? I don't think you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loud Mouth Soup Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 You don't get better by shutting up shop. Where do you come up with these ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerbeast Posted November 2, 2004 Author Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Loud Mouth Soup You don't get better by shutting up shop. Where do you come up with these ideas? If something is broke you fix it right? So you start from square one and regroup. And We won't be playing that many games if any prior to the Gold Cup going by the CSA track record, so we might as well take a break and see where things stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by soccerbeast With all the current mess the national side is in, why not close shop for a year or two skipping next years gold cup.By doing this the CSA can take a full look at where the team is headed. and the manager, who ever he is can travel to countries where our top players are playing and really give them the once over to see if they are in his plans or not. This would also give the U-20 players a chance to make the team and give us a better player pool then we had this wcq campaign. If sure the diehards who resist change won't agree that this might be the best way forward, but we are ranked in the low 90's on FIFA's list in can't be any worse if we closed up the shop. quote:Originally posted by soccerbeast lets just play anyone, don't let the team sit idle like after the last world cup disaster. get games all over the country create interest for the team and the players. I noticed the second one in another thread titled "Lack of Funding" and it's dated today's date as is this thread. So which one do you actually believe? I think this flip-flop indicates that you are just trying to bait others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerbeast Posted November 2, 2004 Author Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Andrew W I noticed the second one in another thread titled "Lack of Funding" and it's dated today's date as is this thread. So which one do you actually believe? I think this flip-flop indicates that you are just trying to bait others. Not true i have just had a fresh outlook on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loud Mouth Soup Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Not true i have just had a fresh outlook on the subject. Avoiding answering the question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerbeast Posted November 2, 2004 Author Share Posted November 2, 2004 I did answer his question. Havn't you ever had a change of mind, it does happen you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by soccerbeast I did answer his question. Havn't you ever had a change of mind, it does happen you know. So you had a complete about-face in a matter of hours? This isn't the first time you posted one view in a thread and posted the complete opposite view in another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Loud Mouth Soup You don't get better by shutting up shop. Where do you come up with these ideas? Maybe from the CSA? Because that's essentially what happened in 1998. I do not think that is what we should do now, but, given the precedent, maybe this isn't so "insane" after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leekoo Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Maybe from the CSA? Because that's essentially what happened in 1998. I do not think that is what we should do now, but, given the precedent, maybe this isn't so "insane" after all. for those of us who missed it, could you tell us what happened in 1998 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mexico86 Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Looking at the NHL shutdown, the CSA could take a step back and look to the future,although I think 2 years would be too much. Has anyone considered Paul James as national team coach? With the luck he has had with the youth side maybe it's time to move him up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canso Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Paul James was in charge at the embarassment of WYC 2001, the team had great talent but they got hammered every game, looked unprepared and disorganized and with no confidence. Dale Mitchell on the other hand did a great job at WYC 2003 with a team of lesser talents, shaped them into a side that was hard to beat and never let them get their heads down, even when they lost their first two games and went behind against Spain in the QFs. Mitchell should take over the MNT, his work with that generation would give us some consistency and an effective style that actually works. Given the senior side has nothing to do until 2008 anyways, let him run both programs and give Frankie the chance to work on his MLS project full time.(unpaid work that is) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mexico86 Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by canso Paul James was in charge at the embarassment of WYC 2001, the team had great talent but they got hammered every game, looked unprepared and disorganized and with no confidence. Dale Mitchell on the other hand did a great job at WYC 2003 with a team of lesser talents, shaped them into a side that was hard to beat and never let them get their heads down, even when they lost their first two games and went behind against Spain in the QFs. Mitchell should take over the MNT, his work with that generation would give us some consistency and an effective style that actually works. Given the senior side has nothing to do until 2008 anyways, let him run both programs and give Frankie the chance to work on his MLS project full time.(unpaid work that is) Nothing to do till 2008? How bout the Gold Cups in 2005 & 2007, the one in 2005 is 8 months away, the team should be getting re-grouped and playing more exhibition matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 This board is amazing. First some changes, now a shut down. Come on boys, we've learned our lesson of 1998 where we took time off before Holger. That's when our rankings dropped badly, and even have to qualify for the Gold Cup. I respect everyone's opinions about the coach changes and such, but to stop for whatever reason is suicidal in any rebuilding endeavour. Keep playing, Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mexico86 Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by redhat This board is amazing. First some changes, now a shut down. Come on boys, we've learned our lesson of 1998 where we took time off before Holger. That's when our rankings dropped badly, and even have to qualify for the Gold Cup. I respect everyone's opinions about the coach changes and such, but to stop for whatever reason is suicidal in any rebuilding endeavour. Keep playing, Canada. The only problem is, who will want to play us? We are not setting the soccer world on fire as of late, and we could only look forward to playing the likes of Belize again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Soccerbeast's proposal is modest to the point of ridiculousness. Maybe you're suggesting that Kevin Pipe had a little bit of Jonathan Swift in him back in 1998, but I'd be willing to bet that closing up shop wasn't the CSA's agenda (hidden or stated). I think that Bobby L's resignation and the delay until the HO was hired had a lot more to do with the inert National Team program than any planned break in the action. The notion that Frank could possibly determine his starting eleven by watching them play individually for their club sides as opposed to gathering them to train together and play games together doesn't merit any more response than "Whatever". I think posting implied support for a poster who is a wind-up artist and nothing more is a bad move. Blair quote:Originally posted by DJT Maybe from the CSA? Because that's essentially what happened in 1998. I do not think that is what we should do now, but, given the precedent, maybe this isn't so "insane" after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Grasshopper I think posting implied support for a poster who is a wind-up artist and nothing more is a bad move. Well, since I explicitly stated that I am against shutting up shop, I certainly didn't mean to implicitly support the opposite. I was merely pointing out that regrouping by taking a year off is something that has happened in the recent past, hence I wouldn't call the idea "insane" as if it is unheard of. True, I don't know how much of 1998 was actually planned, but it must have been to a certain extent, as dropping out of a continental championship is no small thing (at least as opposed to, say, not trying to get friendlies). Sorry if you disagree, but, while I always choose my words carefully, I'm not going avoid posting what I think because it can be construed as supporting soccerbeast (an example of PC censorship, if you ask me). Since we have leekoo asking for details, obviously this wasn't such a bad thing. leekoo, after bombing out of the Hex in 1997 (under Bobby Lenarduzzi), we dropped out of the 1998 Gold Cup and gave our place to Jamaica (if I remember correctly, this was portrayed by the CSA as a move to help Jamaica prepare for the World Cup that summer, though in reality it was about Canada stepping back to regroup), then played only 1 match that year (a friendly versus Macedonia, coached by Bruce Twamley) as we looked for a new coach (eventually Holger Osieck). I wasn't following Canadian soccer very closely at the time, so perhaps others can correct or add details. Maybe this is a stupid thread, but I think there are lots of stupid threads that have nothing to do with soccerbeast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Grasshopper I think posting implied support for a poster who is a wind-up artist and nothing more is a bad move. Well, since I explicitly stated that I am against shutting up shop, I certainly didn't mean to implicitly support the opposite. I was merely pointing out that regrouping by taking a year off is something that has happened in the recent past, hence I wouldn't call the idea "insane" as if it is unheard of. True, I don't know how much of 1998 was actually planned, but it must have been to a certain extent, as dropping out of a continental championship is no small thing (at least as opposed to, say, not trying to get friendlies). Sorry if you disagree, but, while I always choose my words carefully, I'm not going avoid posting what I think because it can be construed as supporting soccerbeast (an example of PC censorship, if you ask me). Since we have leekoo asking for details, obviously this wasn't such a bad thing. leekoo, after bombing out of the Hex in 1997 (under Bobby Lenarduzzi), we dropped out of the 1998 Gold Cup and gave our place to Jamaica (if I remember correctly, this was portrayed by the CSA as a move to help Jamaica prepare for the World Cup that summer, though in reality it was about Canada stepping back to regroup), then played only 1 match that year (a friendly versus Macedonia, coached by Bruce Twamley) as we looked for a new coach (eventually Holger Osieck). I wasn't following Canadian soccer very closely at the time, so perhaps others can correct or add details. Maybe this is a stupid thread, but I think there are lots of stupid threads that have nothing to do with soccerbeast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varsity Tyler Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 We did close for a while. Remember when we failed to play at home for four years? All we did then was take our circus act on the road every once in a blue moon. There's really no difference between that and what you're suggesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varsity Tyler Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 We did close for a while. Remember when we failed to play at home for four years? All we did then was take our circus act on the road every once in a blue moon. There's really no difference between that and what you're suggesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juaninho Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Perhaps putting the National Program on hold is a rather apocalyptic and fruitless solution soccerbeast. With the inception of Holger's Developmental Program - circa 2001 i think - better quality players are on the horizon. Look at our ornery neighbors to the south. After the '94 World Cup, a more cohesive plan for increasing soccer's awareness was put into action - on many levels. It took 8 years before a spike in performance materialised for the U.S. in the 2002 world cup. Although nice, maybe qualification for 2006 was a bit unrealistic for the Men's National Team. This is difficult to suggest, but maybe around 2008 is a better year in which the Men's National team's performance should be measured, when a full 7 or 8 years can bear the fruit of the Developmental Program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurosawa1555362267 Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 I'm all against closing up shop, on the contrary. The national team as to play as many games as is possible. That's what we need, a lot of friendly's. We need to rebuild confidence as a team. It will be a hard thing because it's difficult to bring the guys who play in Europe together to play but it's the only solution. Canada as to get more experience playing together before the Gold Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Get the young guns into the teams and start playing with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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