DeGuzman back to Marseille?

[ditty]

An article on kicker.de states that there is a possibility of Julian DeGuzman returning to Marseille. The article states that the core of the Hannover midfield: Julian, American Steve Cherundolo and Albainian Altin Lala will all have their contracts expire at the end of this season and it will be difficult to sign all three. The club states that they will do their best to try and keep them all. The Marseille transfer sounded more like a rumour to make the discussion the three players' contracts ending a little juicier.

[Grizzly]

I read the article as well and it states that Marseille is observing him. As he is out of contract I think many teams will observe him until he signs somewhere, particularly a lot of Bundesliga clubs. As Bayer Leverkusen wanted to sign him this summer before their manager resigned, there should be interest from some larger clubs than Hannover. Apparently he had agreed to terms with Bayer but Hannover wouldn't let him go and his agent has said that Bayer will be the first team they will talk with about a new contract. I couldn't see him signing to play in a poorer league than the Bundesliga (even if Marseille is a better club than Hannover) unless he particularly loves France or Marseille offers an awful lot of money. From a playing standard he would be far better off to stay with Hannover, sign with a better Bundesliga club or move to a team in another big four league.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by ditty

An article on kicker.de states that there is a possibility of Julian DeGuzman returning to Marseille. The article states that the core of the Hannover midfield: Julian, American Steve Cherundolo and Albainian Altin Lala will all have their contracts expire at the end of this season and it will be difficult to sign all three. The club states that they will do their best to try and keep them all. The Marseille transfer sounded more like a rumour to make the discussion the three players' contracts ending a little juicier.

Interesting. Cherudola, as far I know, is a defender. Worth noting, I saw the Bundesliga tables last noght on TV and was surprised to see Hannover doing so well. In fact they are in the upper part of the table. How will these off-season decisions change if the club actually qualifies for Europe?

[Free kick]

Looks like he has a bright future based on the clubs who covet him. Having said that (as I look back on his WCQ campaign), I would have to consider myself in the camp of those who was expecting more from DeGuzman than what I saw. I am not saying that he played poorly. Far from it. But I thought ( maybe unfairly) that he could be that midfield general in the middle of the pitch from where the offense ran through and be the main supply line for the fwds. I disagree that he gave the ball away too much. I am not saying that he didn't ever give the ball away, but he did not show that rare ability to deliver the decisive and high quality ball.

He was the player that I was most looking fwd to seeing in WCQ. Yes, he has immense technical ability and, by the looks of it, good pace. But, what will remain a memmory for me in this WCQ, is the fact I saw more in the area of high quality balls from an A-leaguer in central MF than from Julian Guzman. I would have told you that your crazy if you would have tried to tell me that prior to the start of WCQ. The good news is he is being coverted and he does have the tools.

[ditty]

I felt deGuzman went 1v1 far too often in WCQ but this may have been a tactical decision coming from Yallop. I agree, my disappointment wasn't that he didn't succeed 1v1 all the time but that the quality of his service was poor relative to a player like Grande. I'd put DeRosario in the same category as DeGuzman, flashes of brilliance but also a consistent culprit when our attack broke down.

[Gian-Luca]

Grande is more of a Demetrio Albertini type midfielder - largely a defensive minded central midfielder good at long balls that can set a striker into the clear but not necessarily the clever incisive through ball the way (just to name drop) a Roberto Baggio would do when played in his proper position behind the two strikers.

I don't think we saw that as much with De Guzman either, though too often I felt his teammates were sometimes guilty of staring at Julian instead of putting themselves into a position where they could receive his pass - watching and waiting to see if he was going to dribble past 3 or four opponents (and to be fair to them, it is a somewhat realistic expectation as quite often he did).

I also think Julian was much better in the games he was playing in central midfield, rather than the right wing, a position he is not used to playing. He is not a proper winger.

[Grizzly]

The problem with expecting him to be a middlefield general is that he is not a middlefield general with Hannover but plays on the left side either as an offensive or defensive mid. He was played on the right by Yallop in a very different tactic than what he is playing in Germany. I was also dissappointed with his WCQ play as well but have watched him play with Hannover and he certainly plays far better there. Some of the Hannover fans consider him to be their most talented player. He is also playing under a coach who knows how to use him far better than Yallop does. In fact, since every one of our top level players dissappointed and many played out of position one has to wonder whether the blame should be placed on them or the coach. We saw that DeGuzman played very well as a left mid under Ossieck against Germany despite playing with a poorer team than was available to Yallop and against far superior opposition.

[redhat]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

We saw that DeGuzman played very well as a left mid under Ossieck against Germany despite playing with a poorer team than was available to Yallop and against far superior opposition.

I agree completely. Julian is quite talented, yet his role in the

team seemed confused. Yallop should have used more prep time to

get everyone used to each other and utilize their strengths to the max.

Well, hindsight is always 20/20.

[Andrew W]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

In fact, since every one of our top level players dissappointed and many played out of position one has to wonder whether the blame should be placed on them or the coach.

I agree with this point. Again, does that come down to a coach that is to rigid in trying to implement his system whereas he sees players in a certain role? I would prefer we have a coach with the flexibility to understand that player A brings this to the table and player B brings this; how can I devise a plan of attack that best takes advantage of their talents. DeRosario and DeGuzman were IMHO, the two most glaring examples of players that were clearly improperly utilized.

[Hannover96Girl]

Greetings from Hannover!

Julian is doing very well, he's the best man on the pitch most of the time. I think he's doing too well for Hannover to keep him. Most articles and statements of the club indicate that he will leave this summer. Hannover 96 is not (yet) a big club which can pay huge salaries.

The names of clubs interested which circulate in the press are Marseille as mentioned , Benfica Lissabon (there are rumors that they were offering a salary of up to 3 million €uros !!!) and Leverkusen.

By the way the Bundesliga is not as good as it used to be I don't really think that a French club is worse than playing for a Bundesliga site, especially Marseille, Benfica in the portuguese league on the other site...

But I'm pretty sure that they are a lot of clubs all overEurope which are also very keen on him!

[The Beaver]

quote:Originally posted by Hannover96Girl

Greetings from Hannover!

Julian is doing very well, he's the best man on the pitch most of the time. I think he's doing too well for Hannover to keep him. Most articles and statements of the club indicate that he will leave this summer. Hannover 96 is not (yet) a big club which can pay huge salaries.

The names of clubs interested which circulate in the press are Marseille as mentioned , Benfica Lissabon (there are rumors that they were offering a salary of up to 3 million €uros !!!) and Leverkusen.

By the way the Bundesliga is not as good as it used to be I don't really think that a French club is worse than playing for a Bundesliga site, especially Marseille, Benfica in the portuguese league on the other site...

But I'm pretty sure that they are a lot of clubs all overEurope which are also very keen on him!

Good to have you on this board. Welcome! And thank you for your insight on Julian and the Bundesliga. Two questions: From what you've seen, what are Julian's biggest strengths as a player? And, in you view, why has the Bundesliga diminished in quality?

[Alex M]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

I read the article as well and it states that Marseille is observing him. As he is out of contract I think many teams will observe him until he signs somewhere, particularly a lot of Bundesliga clubs. As Bayer Leverkusen wanted to sign him this summer before their manager resigned, there should be interest from some larger clubs than Hannover. Apparently he had agreed to terms with Bayer but Hannover wouldn't let him go and his agent has said that Bayer will be the first team they will talk with about a new contract. I couldn't see him signing to play in a poorer league than the Bundesliga (even if Marseille is a better club than Hannover) unless he particularly loves France or Marseille offers an awful lot of money. From a playing standard he would be far better off to stay with Hannover, sign with a better Bundesliga club or move to a team in another big four league.

I'd hardly call France D1 "a poorer" league than the Bundesliga, especially with Monaco reaching the finals of the champions league last season. I think it'd be a great move for De Guzman if he could go back to France. After all, it's that much closer to home.

Alex

[Andrew W]

quote:Originally posted by Alex M

I'd hardly call France D1 "a poorer" league than the Bundesliga, especially with Monaco reaching the finals of the champions league last season. I think it'd be a great move for De Guzman if he could go back to France. After all, it's that much closer to home.

Alex

Don't forget that Marseille was in the UEFA Cup final.

[Grizzly]

I would have to disagree with Hannovergirl's opinion on the Bundesliga. I think the playing level has greatly improved in the last decade due to the influx of players from East Germany and a far greater number of foreign players. The number of foreign players may make it more difficult for German fans to relate to their teams and has changed the playing style but there is not doubt that the skill level is much higher. There is much dissatisfaction in Germany with the Bundesliga, German Football Federation and national team at the present but I think that this general dissatisfaction has led to a fallacious belief that the playing level is not as high as it used to be.

It is also very hard to compare the European leagues living in Europe unless you are travelling arround a lot and watching various leagues. In the majority of large European countries soccer games are broadcast on pay per view and there is no television coverage of leagues in other countries. This pay per view is very expensive. Thus, a fan is often only able to see those games that are in his area in person. When I lived in Germany I almost never saw Bundesliga games except those I personally attended because the tv was ridiculously expensive. In Canada for very small cost I can watch Bundesliga, Premiership, La Liga, Italy and the French league plus the Champions League. Most Europeans form opinions on foreign leagues from written articles or the appearances of the top teams in Champions League and UEFA Cup which does not provide an accurate opinion of the league as a whole. I watch the French league broadcasts here quite often and while I find it good I would still say there is quite a gap with the Bundesliga level. I find it much closer to the level I see in the Russian and Turkish leagues (both of which I have seen a lot) than it is to that of any of the big 4 leagues.

[Grizzly]

quote:Don't forget that Marseille was in the UEFA Cup final.

quote:I'd hardly call France D1 "a poorer" league than the Bundesliga, especially with Monaco reaching the finals of the champions league last season.

People need to stop judging leagues based on the performance of one or two teams in European play as this is not indicative of the league level as a whole. In particular the Loser's Cup (UEFA) is useless and not very indicative of anything. Many mediocre leagues have one or two teams that are capable of performing well in European competition. The French league is pretty decent throughout the table but there is still a big difference in playing level when watching a game between two lower level Bundesliga clubs and two lower table French league clubs. Plus there is a much larger group of clubs in the Bundesliga capable of playing well in European competition than there is in France. I am not knocking the French league, it would be a great league for some of our players to play in but I think it would be a step down for DeGuzman as would Portugal. I think it is better for a player to play on a decent team in a top league than a top team in a lesser league. It was better for Radzinksi to play on Everton in the Premiership than with Anderlecht in Belgium even though Anderlecht is generally a better team than Everton. Likewise it is better for Jazic to play with Kuban in Russia than with Rapid in Austria although if Kuban gets relegated that could change. I think it is much more advantageous to play at a high level every week than have a lot of less challenging games with the occasional European game.

[El Hombre]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

Going on the assumption that he leaves Hannover, would your opinion change if he got more playing time at Marseille than at Bayer?

What are the odds of him stepping into a starting spot at Bayer vs. Marseille? (serious question - my ignorance on this is mindboggling) My impression was that when he was rumoured to go to Bayer that he was going to be used quite a bit less than he is now.

[Hannover96Girl]

I agree it's very hard to compare the levels of the different leagues. I think it's pretty clear though that Spain and Italy are much better than the Bundesliga, player such as Adriano, Kaka, Ronaldinho you don't really see in Germany. The EPL is very good too but I think it's way overrated, I don't believe the hype. Arsenal, Chelsea and ManU are great but the rest of the league is not better than most Bundesliga teams IMO. The style of play in the EPL is great though. Fans in England wouldn't tolerate a team playing such a defensive system like Hannover's coach Lienen plays here in Hannover.

Actually I still believe that the Bundesliga is better than the French league but not much.

Lille who is second just lost to Alemannia Aachen of the German 2nd league in the UEFA cup.

(I know I know , doesn't mean much).

Top clubs in Spain, Italy or England pay much higher salaries than top clubs in the Bundesliga because these countries have tv contrats that give much more money to the clubs or mad owners like Chelsea.

I'm not too worried though, I love the Bundesliga because of the fact that everyone can beat everyone, that ticket prices are still reasonable compared to England for example.

But the thing I like most is that we managed to keep our standing terraces which are so important for atmosphere.

I'm quite optimistic for the National team, I think thre's light at the end of the tunnel finally.

A lot of talent emerged the last two years, especially Lukas Podolski, Kuranyi, Lahm and Mertesacker.

BTW, Hannover won 3:1 today, the 4th win in a row. I didn't see the game so I can't tell you how Julian did but I'm sure he was great again.

[The Beaver]

Interesting to see that the promising new talent for the German national team have strong immigrant roots. Time to stir things up in Germany, me thinks. (A good buddy of mine was born in Germany, moved out here when he was 17. He's been a Canuck for longer than he was a German, but he still follows football and German culture/news. He, too, is hopeful for the future of German soccer.)

Julian will be a stellar player for us someday.

[Hannover96Girl]

quote:Originally posted by The Beaver

Interesting to see that the promising new talent for the German national team have strong immigrant roots. Time to stir things up in Germany, me thinks.

That's true, Klose, Podolski, Kuranyi, Fathi, Matip, Banecki, Dejagah, Azouagh, Odonkor, Trochowski, Senesie, Kucukovic.

Some people forget that Germany is in fact a country with a lot of immigrants.

The biggest group of immigrants is the Turkish community, but most German-Turks decide to play for Turkey.

[Grizzly]

In defence of the German-Turks, the reason that most of them decide to play for Turkey is that most of them are Turkish and not German citizens even if their family has lived in Germany for three generations. Germany does not make it very easy for immigrants to become citizens, birth in the country does not entitle one to citizenship and dual citizenship is not permitted. Of course all of these laws seem to change if one is a talented athlete with national team potential. I know all about Germany's citizenship laws because I was also born there and have also lived 10 years of my life in Germany but not having German blood I had many problems even getting a residence permit. This played a large part in my deciding to leave Germany. I can understand the attitude of Turkish-German players. I would never choose to play for Germany over Canada in any sport if I was good enough to make either team. If I could only play for Germany (and they were to give me citizenship) I might agree to do so but only for career or financial reasons not from the heart.

I agree that Spain is the top league of the big four but think that Italy is as much overrated as the EPL and not currently at the level it used to be at. I also think the Bundesliga is the underrated league of the big four. In watching the four leagues I find the largest gap is between La Liga and the other three who are roughly at a similar level. The Bundesliga may be the weakest of the four but not by very much while I think La Liga is the strongest by quite a margin. The reason I have this opinion is when I watch two poorer Spanish teams play each other the playing level is still very high. I also have to agree with you that a great thing with the Bundesliga is the ticket prices are very reasonable even compared with France and the standing terraces add a lot to the atmosphere. I once wanted to see Paris St. Germain play live and the ticket prices were 2 to 3 times what even the top German clubs charge and I didn't see the point in paying such exorbitant prices for poorer soccer than I could see in Germany. I've never been to an Italian game but ticket prices in England and Spain are also very high.

As far as what I think the best situation would be, it would be where he gets regular playing time at the highest level league. That being said, sometimes one has to take a step back to take two forward and playing at a club like Bayer where they might groom him to take over from some aging top midfielders like Ramelow and Schneider might not be a bad situation. Had he transfered this summer he might not have started every game like in Hannover but Bayer has had some injuries at mid and are also playing in Europe so he would be getting quite a bit of playing time. Both Bayer and Marseille have strong but aging midfields and I would rate both teams about equal but would give Bayer a strong edge because of the league it plays in, ie. strong matches every week. He is also not in a bad situation in Hannover which also seems to be building itself to a better level and does not necessarily have to switch. A top Bundesliga club will make an offer for him and if not this year then the following year. Schalke has also been linked to DeGuzman and that is where former Hannover coach Ralf Rangnick (under whom he developed into a Bundesliga player) is now in charge. I think he would get significant playing time for any of the possible clubs even if he doesn't start every game. I would rate the best situations in the order of Bayer, Schalke, Hannover and Marseille. Of course I am not taking into consideration the small factor of money!