Timotas Posted August 23, 2004 Share Posted August 23, 2004 Who thinks its a tad embarrassing that Canada is doing so poorly at the Olympics? I find it a bit embarassing, with the size and wealth of our country, that we have only produced 5 medals. I know the Olympic funding in this country is ridiciliously horrible, but 5 medals? Cuba has more for christsakes. This happened a few olympics ago to the UK and it was basically a national embarrassment. After many attempts to find a solution, the UK now poors plently of money into Olympic funding and its paying off, 22 medals I believe. Our athletes are trying their best I know, I just think its time the government starts putting more money into olympic funding; I feel bad for these athletes from Canada. I truly feel that it is embarrassing that Canada has done so poorly, but it isn't the athletes faults, its the governments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massive Attack Posted August 23, 2004 Share Posted August 23, 2004 I beg to differ. This isn't the goverments fault. Sports like rowing and swimming get really good funding in this country. I think in the case of this Olympics, there has been some major choking by Canadian athletes/teams that went into their respective events as favourites/defending world champions. Plus, why should I help fund athletes? I wouldn't mind being paid to be an Olympic athlete, instead of working my boring Monday to Friday, 9-5 job. I'd like to travel the world like these athletes do as well, sure, they have to train hard, but that's they price they have to pay. Finally, if anyone is failing our athletes, its corporate Canada. I believe they should fund these athletes, not the government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 What does a country gain by having a great Olympics? Does it damage their reputation? To me I never look at the UK's results and think, man they musn't care about sports. I don't think it's an embarassment for a populous country like India to have humble Olympic hauls. It's hokey as hell, but to me the Olympics are about competing and working hard. Doing your best. We've had a lot of athletes do their best. How about Angela Whyte making the 100 hurdles final? She won't win a medal, but that was a fantastic run. The swimmers were getting mocked, but there were some Canadian records set in the pool. So far no one has embarassed me. Except maybe Rick Say's ranting. Sure people have underachieved. Some have over-achieved. If no one ever choked, there'd never be upsets. That's the fun thing about sports. When I spend money on a pro sports team I expect results and think people should be accountable. I see the Olympics as different. Maybe it isn't, but as long as the Canadian athletes work hard, compete with pride and give an honest effort I'm okay with however they finish. cheers, matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I'm embarrased. I'll explain when I get home from work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedved9 Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 The government should not! be funding sports here in Canada. They have a lot more important things like medi care, defence,etc, to look after. Why can't corporate Canada start funding, When I hEAR Companies spending huge amount of cash on Leaf tickets or corporate box seats and totally ignore amateur sports here in Canada it just drives me insane. Even Frank Stronach who made his billions here in Canada, is investing huge amounts of cash in a mediocore Soccer Club in Austria I THINK THE CLUB is called Rapid Vienna. Why not invest here in Canada, hell start the ball rolling. All it takes is one to start. I look at countries like Italy, and Spain. were companies Like Benneton,WHO HAVE BUILT A LOT FACILTIES IN I taly. or EUSKAlTEL IN sPAIN'S Basque region. along with the citezans in that region they have invested in bike racing team on the pro circuit. called Euskal Euskadi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC supporter Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I'm not embarrassed. But then, I'm not as patriotic as some -- there are just way too many other things in Canada that tick me off more. (Don't get me started on the monarchy, senate and federal patronage culture.) And besides, from everything I see, the Canadian Olympians seem like a pretty damn fine crop of people. Do I think amateur sports in this country are underfunded? Absolutely. Here's two reasons: 1) more support is needed for Olympic athletes, because young athletes and young people need successful role models like Daniel Igali and Silken Laumann. 2) more support is necessary for amateur sport organizations to ensure Canadian kids are participating in sports. Obesity is a real problem in North America and is voracious in eating up our health care dollars. We need well-funded structures that promote wellness by ensuring kids spend more time running or kicking a ball rather than opening a kingsize bag of pork rinds. Corporate Canada has a job here, but the federal government has the leadership role. Do I have confidence in them making amateur sports a priority? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:The government should not! be funding sports here in Canada. They have a lot more important things like medi care, defence,etc, to look after. Yet, they don't fund those very well either, spending more time lining their own pockets, treating themselves like royalty and wasting the rest of the taxpayers money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedved9 Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 Do Kids in school still have the participaction rewards like I had in school oh about 20 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seether Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I think we should be doing better. We shouldn't be getting spanked in the medal standings by third world countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbin Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack I wouldn't mind being paid to be an Olympic athlete, instead of working my boring Monday to Friday, 9-5 job. I'll bet you're making more than $12k/year at your job. That's the stipend that our olympic athletes are asked to live with -- somewhere around $100/month, with no cash bonuses based on games performance. Believe me, I would love to be an olympian. I'm just not good enough -- not only am I physically incapable of achieving what our olympians achieve, I'm also mentally incapable of giving up a cushy white-collar job for a higher calling. I'll pay the bills at least. I don't know what job you do, but you're not getting $1100 a month to do it, no matter what. Let's give a little respect for the sacrifices that our olympians make when they represent us. I have no problem with saying "they should have done better" but I have a huge problem with saying "they get so much and we ask so little in return". We fund our athletes like a third-world country, and our olympians need to beg for handouts. Every medal is earned twice over for Canadians. This isn't to excuse poor performances, but to defend the quality of the performances we've had to date. Incidentally, anyone see our athletes in competition last year at all? See Tunks, or Whyte, or our eights' win? No? Huh. M@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosehead Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by mattbin I'll bet you're making more than $12k/year at your job. That's the stipend that our I don't know what job you do, but you're not getting $1100 a month to do it, no matter what. Let's give a little respect for the sacrifices that our olympians make when they represent us. I have no problem with saying "they should have done better" but I have a huge problem with saying "they get so much and we ask so little in return". We fund our athletes like a third-world country, and our olympians need to beg for handouts. Every medal is earned twice over for Canadians. This isn't to excuse poor performances, but to defend the quality of the performances we've had to date." Agreed. They need to be paid more for sure. They are ambassadors for our country and yet are paid minimum wage rates. If they were paid more they would continue on more and there wouldn't be the early retirement factor of Canadian athletes and given the cost factor of developing a top class athlete this doesn't make sense. What was Romania paying its gold medalists a free apartment and 100,000 USD dollars for a gold medal? and this from the poorest country in Europe. We need to recognize what Canadian athletes do for our country and the sacrifices they make. Money is not the sole answer to our sports problem but athlete and sports funding is still an issue that needs addressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 It shouldn't be hard to find $200 million/year to put towards sports given the amount of waste and graft there is in a Liberal gov't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcl_19 Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 If michael phelps were a country, he's be kicking our ass! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I think Matthew's post is on the money for me. Plus people forget that we're a relatively small country. Heck, Egypt has a greater population than us. The Olympics are about the sports and the spirit, not about whooping Ghana or Thailand in the medal haul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by BC supporter 2) more support is necessary for amateur sport organizations to ensure Canadian kids are participating in sports. Obesity is a real problem in North America and is voracious in eating up our health care dollars. We need well-funded structures that promote wellness by ensuring kids spend more time running or kicking a ball rather than opening a kingsize bag of pork rinds. Quit your pork rind bashing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 While checking the recent medal standing and going by the my recollection of past olympics, the only other countries that underachieve to the same extent as Canada are south American countries like Brazil and Argentina. Argentina is ( in terms of population) the same size as Canada and Brazil is much much larger ( 150 million I think). The one common denomenator amongst those South american counties and Canada is the excessive focus and following ( almost obsession like) that they have for one particular sport. In South america its Soccer and in Canada its hOckey. Hell even yesterday, a totally meaningless friendly between Can & US in hockey managed to make the headlines. Yet private sector funding and sponsorship is really about exposure and how can you get any exposure when all the propaganda is focused on one sport. I don't think that that is healthy and you probably end up with missallocated resources. We are one of the 8-10 wealthiest nations in the world and athletes should be able to get more funding ( private and/or public) than what they are currently getting. Another thing, I wonder how many people grow up dreaming of being a Gymnast, swimmer, skier or track star versus Hockey. I'll bet that number is shrinking more and more as the ever increasing media outlets focus more and more on hockey coverage to grab that short term market share or rating point. You cannot compare Canada to india since India doesn't really have a sporting culture. AS far as Brazil, when they hand out medals for team sports, they will probably end up surpassing us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Marc I think Matthew's post is on the money for me. Plus people forget that we're a relatively small country. Heck, Egypt has a greater population than us. The Olympics are about the sports and the spirit, not about whooping Ghana or Thailand in the medal haul. There are some well documented correlations between GDP and medals. And when you consider that Australia is 2/3s our size, it is pretty clear we are significantly underperforming. However, it is not so much medal counts that leads me to believe that all levels of government need to pony up more. The bottom line is that out elite athletes are only the tip of the iceberg. When Autralia puts in almost $200 millions more than the approximately $70 millions Canada ponies up the effects are not seen only in the results at olympics but inthe development of infrastructure and participation and activity rates among youth. Its about creating a sporting culture that means more than watching Hockey Night in Canada and attending the odd CFL/Raptors/Expos game. Its about creating a culture where being physically active is both affordable and popular. I won't bore you with the benefits in terms of a healthy population (call it preventative health care) or the stats related to the incidence of crime by people who participated in organized activities versus those who have doen not (call it preventative social services). The benefits to society of a healthy active population is huge. Somebody mentioned that Swimming and Rowing were well funded. Well, sorry to disagree. My son swam for two years before moving on, and it cost over $2500 per year for this. It was an outstanding activity in terms of his physical development, in terms of learning about goal setting and the value of working hard - all pretty positive things in a social context. But how many kids do you think participated when the cost was $2500 per year? Same thing with Wrestling, something both sons did for two years (one was a Provincial age group champion). Not as costly as swimming, but still over $1400 each with some serious bingo commitments added in. The Wrestling club they belonged too was geared towards kids form families with less than average economic means - hence all the bingos - and is one of the most scuccessful small clubs in Canada - several cadet national champions grace their walls. But it struggles for a lack of funding and is annually in danger of going under. The Olympic medal count is symptomatic of a bigger problem. A problem that needs to be addressed more than the accumulated debt in my opinion, and one certainly worthy of see some of the surpluses directed towards it. I am not embarrased by the low number of medals, I am embarrassed about the country adopting a "user pay" mentality to organized sport (and music lessons and photography clubs etc.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by matthew What does a country gain by having a great Olympics? Does it damage their reputation? To me I never look at the UK's results and think, man they musn't care about sports. I don't think it's an embarassment for a populous country like India to have humble Olympic hauls. I would think that having a strong olympians brings a great deal of recognition to your country and that is important for a country like Canada ( Unlike Great Britain or India) where very few around the world know much about. Recognition is an intangible asset in that you can't really measure its benefits . It must say something about our health and competitiveness as well as our economic well being. Yes, these are little thing but it could have an impact on the kind of product that a consumer chooses to purchases. You can also look at it that famous and successfull athletes around the world are better know than ambassadors. Think of someone like Jacques Villeneuve or MIke Weir or Donovan Baily. To alot of people around the world, that might be all that they know about Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amacpher Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 The medal standings are meaningless. If you have the world's best swimmer then that's 8 medals in the bag. But if you have the world's best baseballer or soccer player it doesn't even guarantee qualification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by amacpher The medal standings are meaningless. If you have the world's best swimmer then that's 8 medals in the bag. But if you have the world's best baseballer or soccer player it doesn't even guarantee qualification. That is a good point. Romania for example traditionally produces the best female gymnast. Well there are a boat load of medals that a good gymnast can scoop up in gymnastic events. Whereas if you consistantly produce the best decathlete, there is only one medal to to be won. But even if you take that into consideration, I still notice that we tend to be successfull in sports where the field is very limited or small ( eg.: new sports like Trampoline, womens wrestling, hot dog skiing, short track speedskating, synchro swimming, womens soccer). Whereas in International tennis, mens soccer, Swimming, Volleyball,track and field its another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whither Canada Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 I'm goig to set aside the funding issue for a moment here, although it is a significant one. Despite the inadequate funding levels, many Canadian athletes have gone into these games as medal favourites based on actual previous results, i.e. they seem to do be able to do it at other times. What is it about the Olympics that seems to bring out the worst in some Canadain athletes? Just look at the mens' eights (I don't want to pick on an individual so I'll pick on a group). They've won virtually all the races they've run over the last few months. We've had several world champions or medal-ranked contenders going into these games and most have come up empty. This is not the first time it's happened either. It seems to be the Canadian way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whither Canada Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Whither Canada What is it about the Olympics that seems to bring out the worst in some Canadain athletes? We've had several world champions or medal-ranked contenders going into these games and most have come up empty. This is not the first time it's happened either. It seems to be the Canadian way. Perdita Felicien - I rest my case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 Incredible. We didn't have many medal favourites in these games. But after witnessing an improbable win by the aussies over japan and Feliciens misfortune, you have to wonder how much more can go wrong. What next Despatie getting foodpoisoning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Whither Canada many Canadian athletes have gone into these games as medal favourites based on actual previous results, i.e. they seem to do be able to do it at other times. What is it about the Olympics that seems to bring out the worst in some Canadain athletes? . I have to disagree. Aside from from the rowing eights, Despatie, and Felicien, there were not any other ( that I can think of) "sure fire/ cant miss" gold medal favourities. Yes there were good possibilities in baseball and womens diving, Tampoline and a few others. But compared to the past, it was known in advance that the medal haul was going to be realtively slim at these games. Every nation faces a disaster or two just as every country gets a surprise result. So I cannot concure that Canadians just choked or underperformed as a whole. Its more than that in my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 Two rowing chokes, Heyman choking on her final (and easiest) dive to seal Gold, Felicien, ajd the baseball team (which in that circumstance was a choke, whether they were favourites or not). That's a lot of choking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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