Canada vs Costa Rica to be played in Vancouver

[Former Champ]

quote:

Originally posted by SeanKeay

BOO YOU WESTERN Crap Heads.. Ya im talking about you Krammerhead and possibly Current Champ!!!

Heeheehee...

I did make the trip to Kingston though, and 2 to ****ing Winnipeg, so why can't you come out here Mr Grumpypants?

quote:Originally posted by Cheeta

If 10 million Canadians living in southern Ontario can't find it to build a park to rival Swangard...

Remember, of those 10 million Ontarians, ONLY 3,000 CHOSE TO SUPPORT TEAM CANADA in Kingston for game 2.

Attendances for games I been to (from memory)

Edmonton - Mexico, 15,000

Winnipeg - Cuba, 9,000

Winnipeg - Panama, 3,000

Edmonton - Trinidad, 25,000

Kingston - Belize, 9,500

Kingston - Belize, 3,500 (*note attendance for both games would not have filled the stadium once)

Burnaby (next week)- Guatemala, 6,500 (I assume)

... pretty easy to see where the game should have been.

[Massive Attack]

The Kingston attendances were 8,245 for the first game and 5,124 for the second game. The stadium holds about 10,000, so your math is horribly flawed. More people showed up for the meaningless 2nd leg against Belize then the game against Panama in Winnipeg.

You can find recent attendances for Canadian WCQ here:

http://soccer.loop48.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1528

[DarnCherry]

No such thing as a "meaningless" game. Being a supporter means supporting the team no matter how important the game is. Current Champ makes a good point. Out of 10 million Ontarians only 5,000 bothered to attend the second game.

[Massive Attack]

The way Vancouver supported the Canada B team?

Also, contrary to popular belief on this message board, 10 million people don't live within a 1 hour drive of Kingston.

[DarnCherry]

Two totally different scenarios. There were people at the Canada B games who said that until hours before kickoff they didn't even realize any game was taking place. You've been reading the boards, you should know by now there was no promotion of the Canada B games whatsoever.

Nice try though.

[Massive Attack]

The Kingston games weren't promoted here either.

EDIT: Well, I can't speak for promotion inside the city of Kingston, but in the GTA, there was no promotion for the Canada-Belize matches at all.

[Dante79]

the CSA should promote the national team games in every news paper to attrack more people at the games! soccer here in Canada is unfortunately not #1 sport so not everyone is aware that the national team has a game doing that maybe more people would come to the games and little by little there will be more Canada fans!

[DarnCherry]

Even then you are comparing apples and oranges. People from as far away as Vancouver went to Kingston to watch those 2 games. To me that says that there was promotion of this event. Maybe not hugely promoted (thats the CSA way) but there was promotion nevertheless.

The Canada B games were not high profile whatsoever, with the Canada B team added at the last moment. Would Swangard have sold out given the same marketing as the Kingston games? Of course not, perhaps 4,000-5,000 may have shown up for each of the Canadian games. Not bad considering it was the B team, and the games were friendlies with club sides.

quote:Also, contrary to popular belief on this message board, 10 million people don't live within a 1 hour drive of Kingston.

Nobody is saying that. Current Champ was responding to the following quote:

quote:f 10 million Canadians living in southern Ontario can't find it to build a park to rival Swangard...

Wherever they build a park to rival Swangard there won't be 10 million Canadians living near it, so don't expect it to be packed like the Kingston games weren't.

[Cheeta]

Okay, I'll wade in.

The October match in Winnipeg between Canada and Panama so many years ago where only 3,000 something showed up, that was a match between two sides who'd already been eliminated and between them had scored zero goals in getting eliminated. No ones going to buy that. I wasn't there. Not by choice. But I still wasn't there. Hard to expect casual Mom and Pop Canada to show up either.

As far as I can tell, the CSA didn't want anyone to show for the Canada B matchs in BC. May as well have held the contest in a cave in the mountains. No advertising at all. Thank God for the internet.

And no, there are not 10 millions living within an hour of Kingston. But there most certainly are 10 millions, or more, who could day trip it to Kingston. Or make it an overnighter. And isn't that the whole argument of having the CSA's National Stadium dream in southern Ontario? To allow all those potential supporters from Ontario and Quebec to oh-so-conviently travel to the home dates?

It's been way too long between home dates for the MNT and all the markets need to be groomed a-new. As far as I'm concearned heads in the CSA still need to roll for that criminal 4 year gap. But I still support a National Stadium scheme in Ontario.

Just a couple of thoughts. I'm off to catch the Lucania-Blast friendly at Saint Vital Memmorial and get rained on.

[Daniel]

To address Montréal and CCR:

There is an official track, but the fact that within the width is fitted the player benches and a long-jump track might make it narrow.

You can also see here that the goal line could be backed up a few meters on both ends.

http://community.webshots.com/photo/143727129/143728060XRmBgE

An official site has it at 100m x 67.5m. That's FIFA size.

As for the National team not being popular in Montréal, it doesn't help that the team has played on, I believe, 4 occasions EVER in Montréal (1976 Olympics and 1994 v Spain and Morocco). We had 12,000 show up for the women's Canada-Brasil. Put a meaningful qualifier at CCR and you'll get 8,000+.

[redhat]

quote:Originally posted by Cheeta

Okay, I'll wade in.

The October match in Winnipeg between Canada and Panama so many years ago where only 3,000 something showed up, that was a match between two sides who'd already been eliminated and between them had scored zero goals in getting eliminated. No ones going to buy that. I wasn't there. Not by choice. But I still wasn't there. Hard to expect casual Mom and Pop Canada to show up either.

The game in Winnipeg was also on Thanksgiving Day (Monday), as I recall. This didn't help attendance, nor did the lack of CSA/MSA promotion.

But heck I was there, with about 5 of my friends. Cold, too.

I could understand everyone's points, but we should all try to attend

wherever the game takes place. It would be nice to have a game in

Montreal, and if there was, I'd try as heck to be there. But it seems

Yallop prefers a comfortable location and playing surface for the

team, so Vancouver it is. After this round, maybe Montreal or

even St. John's.

I just find it funny that the CSA advocates Field Turf for its stadiums even though the MNT obviously doesn't prefer it.

And yet the Ticos will play on it.

And yeah, although I would (and did) drive to Boston for GC 2003,

I don't expect everyone to do the same; but for those who do travel,

they certainly have enjoyed being part of our crazy group.

[Former Champ]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

The Kingston attendances were 8,245 for the first game and 5,124 for the second game. The stadium holds about 10,000, so your math is horribly flawed.

I was told by locals that capacity was 14,000

And I specifically remember the announced attendance being under 4,000 for game 2. The reserved side (not seen on TV) was virtually empty.

Is this Junior High School were I have to quote my sources? And doule check all my statistics? Can you remember the attendance (to within 80%) of sport events you saw 7 years ago?

And to those francophones who think I hate Quebec, I would be extatic if the held a qualifyer in Montreal, and happily travel the 5,000 to see St. Vincent and the Grenadines there.

[Massive Attack]

I checked the CP articles for both games, the attendances I gave are correct. The capacity of the stadium is 10258 according to the World Stadiums website:

http://www.worldstadiums.com/north_america/countries/canada/ontario.shtml

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead

I have always had the same reservation in that there is an element of the population in that city who don't really care for national teams. But, like anything else, you can't generalize these things and say that about every single one of the 3.2 million people who live in that area. There is also a segment of of an estimated size of about 1 mill to 1.5 mill who really feel an attachment to canada. Thats about the same size as many larger areas in canada who regularly get to host these events. Plus how do you explain that the city NEVER has hosted any mens WCQ whereas much tinier areas like St. Johns has?

Plus if the CSA is so worried about the things that you have alluded to then why did they play the womens U19 WCQ events there?

[Former Champ]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

I checked the CP articles for both games, the attendances I gave are correct. The capacity of the stadium is 10258 according to the World Stadiums website:

I looked at those numbers. So I guess I was exactly correct for the attendances of the Edmonton game. There seemed to be exactly 15,000 and exactly 25,000. What are the odds?!?! (wait it,s 1 in a thousand).

The first chat I had with some locals (Queen's Universtiy students, who watch games in that stadium regularly) they talked about the 'new seating, about 4,000 seats.

M.A. stop believing everything you read ver batum. We live in the misinformation age.

[Massive Attack]

Current Champ,

I give you actual hard facts and you reply that we live in an age of misinformation? This isn't a debate about terrorism or weapons of mass destruciton.

[Gian-Luca]

Richardson Stadium only holds about 10,000 and there was over 5000 at the 2nd game (and that was what was announced to), which is a good crowd for a match where the result was a foregone conclusion against an extremely weak team on a Wednsday in a fairly small city. I've no idea what on earth Current Champ is talking about.

[DarnCherry]

quote:Originally posted by Free kick

I'm not generalizing anything. I just made the comment that somebody had recently posted in another thread that there is not much interest in the national team in Montreal. I just threw that out there as another piece of input to the discussion. I didn't say the information was correct or incorrect. I do remember nobody posting anything contrary after that poster had made the comment.

What are the things I have alluded to that the CSA is so worried about. FieldTurf? Football lines? Please don't bring up the womens under 19 WCQ events. Thats a womens kids tournament. Nobody cares what they play on. I find it funny that some people think the importance of playing surface, criteria for stadiums and importance of where games are held would be the same for a womens kid tournament as it would be for the mens national team.

[Former Champ]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

Current Champ,

I give you actual hard facts and you reply that we live in an age of misinformation? This isn't a debate about terrorism or weapons of mass destruciton.

So which CSA bureaucrat was right? The one who made the announcement at the game, or the one who wrote the number down in a book?

Anyway, I wasn't even talking about politics, brcause there is enough wrong information out there for everybody. I remember the first time I logged onto the internet looking for soccer stats. the first site I found said Canada had made it to the second round of World Cup '86...we tied France and beat Hungary apparentally. Which confused the hell out of me.

So are those hard facts about the Edmonton attendances exactly correct? Highly dubious.

I guess this is Jr. High. From now on i'll be sure to add a bibliography and have my verbal facts notarized.

[Daniel]

I know it's hockey, but there'll be 2 games of the WCH played at the Bell Centre (USA and Slovakia). People will turn up for their country and even the separatists Québécois know that they are Canadian. The question is what kind of crowd would show up for a WCQ game. Some Voyageurs, as usual, but would the rest be families? soccer fans? etc.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Daniel

I know it's hockey, but there'll be 2 games of the WCH played at the Bell Centre (USA and Slovakia). People will turn up for their country and even the separatists Québécois know that they are Canadian. The question is what kind of crowd would show up for a WCQ game. Some Voyageurs, as usual, but would the rest be families? soccer fans? etc.

If you say : " People will turn up for their country and even the separatists Québécois know that they are Canadian." But then why are you sceptical the in viability of WCQ matches there? Especially considering that, unlike other canadian cities, the support for club soccer has always been there. I am further confused by : "The question is what kind of crowd would show up for a WCQ game. " But would those concerns be any different in any other city?

Plus unlike the past, there are players on this squad that fans and media could identify with? would't you agree?

[Former Champ]

Y'know... Montreal would be the best venue for a game against the States. Make it as unpleasant for Sam's Army as possible.

[Dante79]

quote:Originally posted by Free kick

If you say : " People will turn up for their country and even the separatists Québécois know that they are Canadian." But then why are you sceptical the in viability of WCQ matches there? Especially considering that, unlike other canadian cities, the support for club soccer has always been there. I am further confused by : "The question is what kind of crowd would show up for a WCQ game. " But would those concerns be any different in any other city?

Plus unlike the past, there are players on this squad that fans and media could identify with? would't you agree?

I agree with you FREE KICK plus not everybody is in love with hockey! if I had the choice in going to WC hockey match and WCQ match I wouldnt think twice and ill go to the soccer game and if I think like that there must be many people that think like me!

[DJT]

quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead

I'm not generalizing anything. I just made the comment that somebody had recently posted in another thread that there is not much interest in the national team in Montreal. I just threw that out there as another piece of input to the discussion. I didn't say the information was correct or incorrect. I do remember nobody posting anything contrary after that poster had made the comment.

I was one of the people who recently posted in another thread that there isn't much interest in the men's national team in Montreal. This was based completely on what Daniel has conveyed to me (some of which he reasserted in his post earlier in this thread).

To be clear, in that thread we were talking about installing temporary grass in Olympic Stadium for a WC qualifier. That would be ridiculous if you ask me, mostly because the money and organization involved would be too much to do in any city, but then on top of that in Montreal there is this issue regarding a lack of interest.

I wasn't really saying anything about CCR. I am open to that possibility --- but it would have to be the right match. For one thing, there may be another issue regarding the strong support that might exist for some Central American/Caribbean countries in Montreal. Daniel, perhaps you could comment on this issue.

BTW, I'm just clarifying my position. I'm not saying that Krammerhead took my comment out of context or anything. I think he raised a valid point.

[Daniel]

What I'm saying is that there hasn't been an expensive ticket for soccer in this city since, what? the Olympics?

Families are used to paying 5$-10$ per head, and slightly more for WNT games. Would the families show up for 35$?

And since the Nats have pretty much never played Montréal, it's hard to predict who would show up because there's not much to rest on. The stadium would be packed, guaranteed, but by whom? That's what's left to be seen.

Of course, the media would jump on board (soccer is so "in) and the presence of Gervais, Bernier, Occéan and Sutton (all reasonnable choices) would help.

The teams you'd want to avoid playing in Montréal are Haiti (but they're out) and maybe say Honduras, Guatemala and maybe El Salvador. Other teams would attract some local supporters, but with an effective ticketing policy, the crowd would be pro-Canadian.

The best game to play there would be a Hex game against the States with limited away seating and a strict ticket policy (HA! CSA and "strict" in the same sentence?).