JayWay Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Ugh. http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/LondonFreePress/Sports/2004/07/20/549275.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Bait. Bait, bait, bait, bait. Think I'll nibble a little before I swallow the hook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by JayWay Ugh. http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/LondonFreePress/Sports/2004/07/20/549275.html Well if we are going to deny him this opportunity based solely on the fact that he was a nationalist, then how far do you want to go? would we deny him the right to represent canada at the olympics? Might as well do that as well, No?. There are other athletes from other parts of canada, who represent canada at the olmpics whose political views are likely not shared by yourself or myself. Do you believe he is the only athtete from Quebec who is a nationlist? You cannot deny someone on that criteria otherwise what would we have become? I feel that pointing that out in this article is highly inappropriate and irresponsible. The athlete chosen for this kind of honnor needs to be someone who is successfull and best reflects the human values that we feel as canadians. Not just the phoney stuff of waving the flag because anyone can wave a flag, its the easy thing to do. But basic values of hardwork, perseverance and being a good role model are what counts. Beside flagwaving is a uniquely American. No other country is as "in your face" with the flag than americans. And perhaps the Aussies. Do we want to become like that? Nothing against wrapping yourself in the flag at an international soccer match since you are showing support for the side that your cheering for that day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue and White Army Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Hey, some track bird once waved around a Saskatchewan flag after winning an Olympic medal.... and I was deeply offended!!! [] Gill said: "In Canada, we have different cultures and you should be proud of your culture. I'm very proud of my culture." I couldn't agree more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Well if we are going to deny him this opportunity based solely on the fact that he was a nationalist, then how far do you want to go? would we deny him the right to represent canada at the olympics? Might as well do that as well, No? To carry the flag at the Olympics is not a right, it is a privilege - a privilege that is handed down through a highly subjective process of selection. When choosing the flag-holder out of over 200 Canadian athletes, I’d like to think that the condition “does not want to tear the nation apart” would be a good place to start thinning out the candidates. The part that bugs me the most about this is not the fact that he will be carrying the flag, but rather, who’s being denied the opportunity as a result. I think we can mostly say that, from afar, to the average Canadian, the ritual of carrying the flag into the opening ceremonies is hardly an one that causes us to choke back tears of patriotic pride. The significance of such a tradition would probably lay exclusively with the athlete who has been bestowed the honour. While as Canadian couch-potatoes, we probably don’t see it as a big deal, I can bet that if any of us got the opportunity to hold our flag in front of a worldwide audience, that it would be a huge source of pride. So it bothers me that there are upwards of 200+ athletes who have missed out on the opportunity of a lifetime to display their pride and love for Canada all for one guy who by his own words, doesn’t really compete for Canada (but does dream of carrying the flag of his province into competition one day…). No one is denying Nicolas Gill any of his rights, or suggesting that’s what should be done. Carrying the nation’s flag is undeniably an act linked with nationality; hence, I feel that somewhere in the * subjective * process of determining who was best suited to carry out this * nationally-linked activity * that it was a mistake to choose someone who’s national identity lies elsewhere. quote: There are other athletes from other parts of canada, who represent canada at the olmpics whose political views are likely not shared by yourself or myself. Do you believe he is the only athtete from Quebec who is a nationlist? No. And they shouldn’t be carrying the flag either (the nationalists, not those who share different views from mine). quote: You cannot deny someone on that criteria otherwise what would we have become? A nation with some backbone? quote: The athlete chosen for this kind of honnor needs to be someone who is successfull and best reflects the values that we feel as canadians. Of course. However you also can’t deny (as stated previously) that the act of carrying the flag * is * an act of national identity. It of course represents many things, but at the core of it, it still represents being Canadian. If we are to have Nicolas Gill carry the flag because he supposedly embodies Canadian values (and from what I’ve heard of him, he certainly does… at least some of them), then why do we need a Canadian at all? Why not Nelson Mandela? Why not the Dhali Lama? Certainly these individuals possess qualities that the average Canadian aims to duplicate and live up to? The reason we don’t select such non-Canadians is because while the act of carrying the flag is certainly related to a number of the factors you mentioned, at the core of it, it is still an act of national identity and pride, and thus should be carried out by a Canadian. Hence, I believe Nicolas Gil is a poor choice. quote: Beside flagwaving is a uniquely American. No other country is as "in your face" with the flag than americans. And perhaps the Aussies. Do we want to become like that? Nothing against wrapping yourself in the flag at an international soccer match since you are showing support for the side that your cheering for that day. I believe we’ve now reached a record high for ubber-political correctness. Now, not only is it taboo to be patriotic and to wave a flag innocently on opportune occasions, but the very act of * acknowledging * that you are Canadian – even if it’s just in your head! – is equal to marching down to the border, applying for US citizenship, wrapping yourself in the Stars and Stripes and lighting off fireworks singing Yankee Doodle Dandy. Remember that scene from Ghostbusters? The one with the Staypuffed Marshmellow Man? “Quick! Everybody…clear your minds! Don’t let anything related to Canada slip into your thought process! Clear your minds. Even the slightest thought of anything Canadian will immediately result in the instant Americanization of our entire country. CLEAR. YOUR. MINDS!” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Whatever. If he was such a nationalist, he'd refuse to carry the flag. Nick Gill deserves some respect as he represented our country, wore our uniforms, and carried our passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 JayWay, you are a disgrace to Canada. I mean the guy has won a couple medals for us and you never complained. He wore our uniform and you never complained. The anthem gets played, the athletes honour it, you never complain. Which suggests that you are just a mean-spirited little prick who desperately needs to get a life. And maybe a new country, as I don't think you have a clue where you live and what Canada means. I think the kind of country you'd really be proud of is North Korea, if you want I can send you one-way flight information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanKeay Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 ATTACK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. JayWay, you are a disgrace to Canada. I mean the guy has won a couple medals for us and you never complained. He wore our uniform and you never complained. The anthem gets played, the athletes honour it, you never complain. Which suggests that you are just a mean-spirited little prick who desperately needs to get a life. And maybe a new country, as I don't think you have a clue where you live and what Canada means. I think the kind of country you'd really be proud of is North Korea, if you want I can send you one-way flight information. I'm a disgrace to Canada because I'd rather see someone who truly loves this country carry the flag than someone who voted to tear it apart? I see. In that case there are quite a few "mean spirited little pricks" living in this country because at least 50% of the response to this story has been more in line with what I've had to say. And as far as Gill's participation in the olympics and his contribution goes... If it makes you feel any better, I won't be cheering for him in the Olympics. But then I won't be cheering *against* him either. I just have very little motivation to get enthusiastic about the efforts of someone who voted 'OUI' in '95. Mr. Gill benefits as much personally from his Olympic ventures as does his country. He said it himself, he doesn't compete for Canada; he competes for himself. I'll take the same position as I would if, say, Hargreaves was somehow booted off the English national team and afforded the opportunity to suit up for Canada. Despite any drop off in ability, and the potential hit to the team's results, I'd rather support a lesser team with a player who cares about the country than a stronger team with Hargreaves in that place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC supporter Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Like the incident last week in which some people tried to say it was a national insult that FOX TV cut to a commercial rather than showing the Canadian anthem at the baseball all-star game, I can't get exorcised about this. I'll leave it for the Americans or the Don Cherrys of the world. I'm interested in what happens on the field, not the peripheral jingoism that often surrounds it. Don't know who carries the flag, and don't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by JayWay You say that carrying the flag is not a right but a privilige.. Of course its not a right. Who ever said that. But its also a provilige to belong to Augusta National Golf club, but do you want to apply the same standards as they do. How can you rely on federal dollars and deny someone this privilege based on how they voted. We might as well be a Totalitarian state in thats case. As long as he does't abuse the privilige I have no problems with that selection. You say that Carrying the nation’s flag is undeniably an act linked with nationality. Thats true, and in a samll way I agree with you that a certain measure subjectivity must be used in this process in that I would not favour someone who openly and publically has repeatedly displayed a political agenda that favours sovereignty. But I cannot think of anyone off hand who has gone to that extreme. perhaps Myriam Bedard is the closest but the price to deny someone this right would be greater than the consequences. your quote: "Of course. However you also can’t deny (as stated previously) that the act of carrying the flag * is * an act of national identity." My response: Since when has this ever been a criteria? Furthermore, how would you go about judging that criteria. Does someone have to have a maple leaf on their underwear. As far as national identity, well what is and try to define it. No one can and everytime they try they do it from their own narrow perspective while totally ignoring or understanding those who are outside the boundaries of where they live. Your quote: " Now, not only is it taboo to be patriotic and to wave a flag innocently on opportune occasions, but the very act of * acknowledging * that you are Canadian – even if it’s just in your head! – is equal to marching down to the border, applying for US citizenship, wrapping yourself in the Stars and Stripes and lighting off fireworks singing Yankee Doodle Dandy" reponse: I am totally confused here. Since when has it been or become taboo to wave your own flag in canada. It NEVER has and never will be. Where is the evidence of this? The talk of patriotism is BTW a very uniquely american trait. So while those who think that patriotism makes them good canadians, I say that it only reflects how the US cultural influence has a strong grip on our society. There are so many more important traits that canadian should be proud of, but your looking at only the superficial ones. Those traits that count are the more human traits in their hearts and minds and their attitudes and beliefs. And most importantly their sence of belonging. Of course you should display those superficail traits when you are, say, at an international soccer game. Because that is what we call supporting your team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by BC supporter I'll leave it for the Americans or the Don Cherrys of the world. I'm interested in what happens on the field, not the peripheral jingoism that often surrounds it. That's a good adjective and one that I was trying thinking of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amacpher Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by JayWay Don't forget, they also have to hold the bible while singing. Seriously though, I think nationalism appeals to our most basic, simplistic brain cells. While everyone will be flocking to their TV's to watch some judo competition that they don't understand and will never watch again, I think I'll prefer to be watching something better on GolTV. [:I] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 ‘Tony, There seems to be some confusion about where I’m standing on this issue. For some reason you’ve decided to bring the concept of patriotism into play. I never mentioned any flag-waving ideals or anything like that. You brought it up first: quote: No other country is as "in your face" with the flag than americans. And perhaps the Aussies. Do we want to become like that? Nothing against wrapping yourself in the flag at an international soccer match since you are showing support for the side that your cheering for that day. To me, this is not an issue of any varying degree of patriotism. This is an issue of one simple question: are you Canadian or are you not? I don’t care if Mr. Gill is the most patriotic Canadian since Stompin’ Tom. Nor do I care if he’s rather apathetic towards his homeland. The only thing that matters is whether he is Canadian or not. Oui or Non? Simple. Let’s, for arguments sake, assume that Mr. Gill is not a separatist and that his entire situation is exactly the same with one main difference: In 1995 he voted ‘NON’. Now according to Steve Simmons’ article, Mr. Gill feels more Quebecois than Canadian. Had this been the case should he have voted NON against separation, than to me there would be no issue here. He’s obviously not the most patriotic Canadian, but as you said (and I agree), what’s most important about the flag bearer is the values and traits he projects; this is most important – the fact that he is Canadian should only a small core necessity. The problem is, he’s not Canadian. He voted OUI and to me that is a very direct statement that he rejects his status as a Canadian. It has nothing to do with * how * Canadian he is. Only that he is Canadian. Now, second. Once again, let me state that the issue is not who is carrying the flag, but who isn’t. I’m not going to watch the ceremonies and be totally disgusted at the sight of Mr. Gill carrying the flag. In fact, I find it more funny than sad. What I find sad is the fact that true Canadians – over 200 of them! – have missed out on the opportunity to do something that would mean so much to them – something that has been given to an athlete who would rather be carrying the flag of Quebec than of Canada. Now to your points… quote: You say that carrying the flag is not a right but a privilige.. Of course its not a right. Who ever said that. But its also a provilige to belong to Augusta National Golf club, but do you want to apply the same standards as they do. How can you rely on federal dollars and deny someone this privilege based on how they voted. We might as well be a Totalitarian state in thats case. As long as he does't abuse the privilige I have no problems with that selection. You say that Carrying the nation’s flag is undeniably an act linked with nationality. Thats true, and in a samll way I agree with you that a certain measure subjectivity must be used in this process in that I would not favour someone who openly and publically has repeatedly displayed a political agenda that favours sovereignty. But I cannot think of anyone off hand who has gone to that extreme. perhaps Myriam Bedard is the closest but the price to deny someone this right would be greater than the consequences. You suggested that the fact I believe he should be denied the opportunity would subsequently mean that I believe he should be denied other rights, such as competing. I see his place in the Olympics as a right because he went out and earned it. He qualified based on his own merit and based on a set of objective qualification standards set down by the COC; no one handed him the opportunity to compete. Hence, it’s his right to compete, not a privilege. The privilege to carry the flag, on the other hand, was handed to him by a panel of judges who came to their decision based on subjective analysis. He was handed this opportunity, hence I see it as a privilege, whereas his place in the Olympics is his right. I hope that clears everything up on that front… quote: But its also a provilige to belong to Augusta National Golf club, but do you want to apply the same standards as they do. How can you rely on federal dollars and deny someone this privilege based on how they voted. We might as well be a Totalitarian state in thats case. You seem to be confused about what actually took place here. To an extent, those standards * were * applied. The COC assigned a panel of five officials to go over the respective accomplishments of each Canadian athlete competing in Athens. There job was to weigh and compare each athlete’s accomplishments in order to determine which were better. From what I’ve heard, it does sound like quite a harsh process if you think about it. Now remember, I didn’t assign these rules of judgment. I’m only here commenting on the result. Now as I said before, I don’t believe Mr. Gill to be a true Canadian. This has nothing to do with any judgment on my part or any concept in my head of what a “true Canadian” should be. In my opinion, Mr. Gill made that decision when he voted QUI for separation. He voted to tear the country apart, he rejected his Canadian status. If we can agree that Canadian identity and pride has at least * a little * to do with the carrying of the flag, than shouldn’t it be obvious that Mr. Gill’s rejection of Canadian status be an instant signal that he should be out of the running for the position of flag carrier? There are over 200 athletes in the running for this! Whether you like it or not, there are going to be certain qualifications that are used to immediately cut this group down to a select few candidates. No medals – off the list. Never competed before – off the list Has carried the flag before – off the list Denies his status as a Canadian and votes to tear the country apart – off the list. To me this seems like common sense. Am I totally off base here? I have no bone to pick with separatists. We live in a free country and people are free to hold whatever political opinions they like. If Mr. Gill feels that Quebec’s future is as a sovereign nation – so be it. I respect that. But that decision also means that he is not fit to represent all Canadians by being a flag carrier if he, himself, does not even consider himself Canadian. I don’t see the difference between someone who consistently pushes his political agenda and someone who merely holds it; at least not in this case. To me, Mr. Gill’s opinion on separation are not like, say, if he was a racist and dislikes coloured minorities. In that case the fact that he consistently airs his opinion would be the problem. But he’s not a racist; he’s a separatist. And I don’t feel that his being a separatist is in anyway deserving of disrespect. It’s not that I think his opinion is not valid, it’s just that I see it as a rejection of his status as a Canadian. Simple. quote: My response: Since when has this ever been a criteria? Furthermore, how would you go about judging that criteria. Does someone have to have a maple leaf on their underwear. As far as national identity, well what is and try to define it. No one can and everytime they try they do it from their own narrow perspective while totally ignoring or understanding those who are outside the boundaries of where they live. Again with the patriotism angle… I didn’t say Canadian “pride”. I said Canadian “identity.” As I said in the previous bit, that can mean any degree of pride or association with Canada – just as long as there is a degree of recognition and embracement of his status as a Canadian. Unfortunately, IMO, he failed to do this by voting for separation. quote: reponse: I am totally confused here. Since when has it been or become taboo to wave your own flag in canada. It NEVER has and never will be. Where is the evidence of this? The talk of patriotism is BTW a very uniquely american trait. So while those who think that patriotism makes them good canadians, I say that it only reflects how the US cultural influence has a strong grip on our society. There are so many more important traits that canadian should be proud of, but your looking at only the superficial ones. Those traits that count are the more human traits in their hearts and minds and their attitudes and beliefs. And most importantly their sence of belonging. Of course you should display those superficail traits when you are, say, at an international soccer game. Because that is what we call supporting your team. The way you put it (comparing Canadian patriotism to American patriotism) made it seem like you felt flag waving was something that should be frowned upon. BTW, I think you are making one significant mistake in your criticism. Your issue is not with patriotism itself – the Americans are not the sole owners of patriotic feeling, nor did they invent it – your concern is with the American * style * of patriotism. Canadians are patriotic. In fact I believe they’ve been charted as amongst the most proud citizens on Earth. Canadians just tend to express it differently. The stereotypical Canadian patriotism is, compared to the Americans, more private and reserved. A security of self and identity that one keep in his/her heart; whereas Americans are more prone to public displays of their national affection. Que Sera. But once again, you’re bringing patriotism up when really it’s not an issue. And again, I agree with you. Flag waving is a good thing, but only at certain events. Read my post again – I said it’s good at “opportune times”. This means, like you said, at international soccer games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 I think that one of the things that makes Canada great is that fact that people can vote Oui ou Non ou j'ne sais pas. We tend to greatly underestimate the strength that tolerance gives us as a nation, and inevitably, the least tolerant of us (generic general statement rather than directed at individuals) turn out to be the worst Canadians. Mr. Gill cast a vote and accepted the result. The Seperatisists in Quebec are not resorting to revolution or force to get their way, and neither are the people opposed to seperation. Our response to the threat: The Clarity Act. Oooh, legislation. Where are the tanks, the Civil War, the violence? How very Canadian on both sides. I see it to our Credit as a nation that we can select Mr. Gill to carry the Canadian flag despite his sovereigntist views and it speaks to our strength as a people that these veiws were never part of the equation. Our national "style" requires us to live with ambiguity, it requires tolerance - real tolerance - of a diverse range of cultures and political viewpoints. I find, despite our profound differences with regards to the sanctity of the political entity know as Canada, that I am far more comfortable with the views and values of most of the Bloc Quebecois as opposed to, say, the people of Three Hills Alberta. All decent enough folk, the latter, but virtually all of them see the world, and Canada differently than I. I wouldn't begrudge one of them the right to carry the Canadian Flag, any more than I would begrudge a soveriegntist. In fact, I sometimes think that I would prefer a Canada with a seperate Quebec than a unified country with Three Hills setting the social and moral tone of the country. But hey, they have the right to their views...and to me, the last part is a defining characteristic of Canada. I can live with the ambiguity of being Canadian. I like the result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 But people voted Yes in the referendum for different reasons. Thats why we have a law interoduced in Ottawa called the clarity act. Opinions in Quebec on the national unity issue are much more wide ranging that you could imagine. The outcome depends a great deal on the question asked and/or how you phase. We don't know when he answered the of how he voted, where exactly he stands. We don't know if he even pays all that much attention to politics. PLus people have been known to change their views. Regarding your second point about this privilige having a greater significance to other canadians than a quebecer who voted yes in the refrendum in 1995. Well again your getting into a grey area and you will never know the truth here because people will always say in the media what you and I want to hear; the PR stuff. Take for example all those canadian athletes like hockey players who like to spew that propaganda about what a special feeling it is to represent the maple leaf and wave it at so and so event. Well there are some who have stopped living in Canada and taken out US citizenship and probably never return unless for business reasons or something like that. Consider a certain number 99 who once played hockey. Where does he live these days? are his kids canadian. Plus he owns a hockey team but is it one that play played for in Canada, who once needed and injection of capital. There are others, I am sure who train and live in the US, cause it a better environment for preparation and likely seldom ever return to canada. Would that make them more suited to be a flag bearer, under your criteria, than a guy who voted yes in the refrendum But actually lives in Canada and pays taxes here? You have to look at international sports as a situation where by you are cheering more the country they represent. Thats what is important. Gotta go now but I can reposnd to your other points later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Continuation: your quote: " No medals – off the list. Never competed before – off the list Has carried the flag before – off the list Denies his status as a Canadian and votes to tear the country apart – off the list. To me this seems like common sense. Am I totally off base here? " response: I think I responded to this point in my post above where I said, just because one votes "yes" doesn't mean that he/she is denying their status as a Canadian. Plus most successfull athletes have to compete for themselves first and foremost. To be clear, regarding the national unity issue. As I mentioned in my original post, I can can agree with you to a very small degree. I have heard some viewpoints in Quebec in the past whereby, if I were to learn that a certain athlete shared these type of views, I too would question their selection for such an honor such as flag bearer. But the type views that I am alluding to really represent only a small minority people. Furthermore, these kind of viewpoints are seldom (if ever) found amongst the segment represented by athletes( amateur or profession). Plus, as Gordon mentioned, you might find other extreme views in other parts of the country as well. But based on what we know, I have seen no evidence that Gill falls into this category. PLus, if he did, he would probably refuse to carry the flag. What you cannot do is get into witch hunts when it comes to national honors or recognitions based on how they voted in the past or what they said on a certain political or social topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 I'll admit I didn't read all of this, so I'm assuming no one here actually knows Nicolas Gill. I don't know him well, but I have friends who do. He's a very quiet and humble man. He's not very good in front of the camera and isn't one to seek out attention. I don't want to speak for him, but perhaps his comments in the past didn't come out the way he may have wanted them to. Since being selected he has said the right things and I believe he does view this as a great honour. I don't think if you gave Gill 10 words that best describes himself, he'd throw 'seperatitist' at the top of the list. I know it's a hot-button topic, but I don't think it defines him as an athlete. cheers, matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beachesl Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 A bit more of a balanced article: http://www.cbc.ca/story/olympics/national/2004/07/19/Sports/athens-flagbearer040719.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosehead Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 Let the athletes decide who is the flag carrier, not the bloody politicians. They probably wanted to send a message, sucking up to the separatists. If the Canadian atheletes respect Gill and decide on Gill that is fine with me. I agree people do change their views and unless Gill is a total hypocrit he must be Canadian if he agrees to take the flag. From a political stand point it would be interesting to know who has been the Canadian flag bearers since 1984 and thought they changed the rules in Salt Lake so that the atheletes would decide who it would be. Worst flag carrier was J L Brassard who sort of wanted to but didn't and that blamed carrying the flag on his subsequent mediocre performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Moosehead it would be interesting to know who has been the Canadian flag bearers since 1984 The answer to your question was in the morning papers. But I can't find an on-line version of the list. So i'll copy and type Summer Olympics flag bearers: 2000-Caroline Brunet-Kayaker-earned silver 1996-Charmaine Crooks-Track-No medal 1992-Michael Smith-Decathlon-No Medal 1988-Carolyn Waldo-Synchro Swimm-2 Golds 1984-Alex Baumann-Swimming-2 Golds Winter Olympic flag bearers: 2002-Catriona Lemay-Doan-Speed skating-Gold 1998-Jean Luc Brassard-Moguls- No Medal 1994-Kurt Browning-Figure skating-No Medal 1992-Syvie Daigle-Speed skating-Gold 1988-Brian Orser-Figure skating-Silver 1984-Gaetan Boucher-Speed skating-2 Golds 1 bronze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosehead Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 To be honest I'm with jayway on this one. Too often in Canada we suck up and celebrate those who don't like or reject Canada as that feeds into our own insecurity and we want to change them bring them on to our side, rather than celebrating the ones that embrace Canada (and not necessarily in the Ingali sentimental way). The same happens in Canadian soccer we don't embrace Stalteri whose a world class talent and who happens to play for Canada with no questions asked, but no the media focus on Hargreaves the one who choice his father's home land over his own, ignores the Canadian media and still manages to grab the headlines. Just a thought, if it was all the athletes voting I could live with it no problem, but this 5 member panel who decided I don't buy into it and there is political overtones to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted July 21, 2004 Author Share Posted July 21, 2004 quote:To be honest I'm with jayway on this one Oh, Moosehead. You say that like it's a bad thing. All of a sudden agreeing with JayWay is tantamount to admitting you listen to Roch Voisine. "I'm not gay or anything, but Jay makes a good point..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 I'm with JayWay as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 The fact that Gill voted for seperatisim really irks me. Voting for independence in '95 after winning a Bronze in '92 is more than enough for me to not acept Gill as a flag bearer. Here's a list they should've used: Perdita Felicien Nicolas Macrozonaris Alison Sydor Alexandre Despatie Ian Millar Susan Nattrass Carol Montgomery Simon Whitfield Daniel Igali Guivi Sissaouri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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