Danny Boy Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 had their ticket prices at a more reasonable level, would they get the same attendances as Montreal? I was looking at Montreal's prices and they are very reasonable, around the 10 dollar range on average. Should the other teams follow suit, to encourage fans to show up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Well the answer is no. Capacity at Swangard for Whitecaps games is 5,722. Any more than that and they turn you away, as happened to many unfortunate fans on opening night. Secondly Montreal is a non-profit organization. They can afford to sell dirt cheap tickets, and lets face it tickets that cheap are almost a giveaway. Only $5 if you are under 18, and if you are under 18 and buy a fan club pass it's only $20 for the whole year. Vancouver on the other hand is a business. Personally I don't think the Whitecaps tickets are unreasonable. I don't think other teams should follow suit, not at Montreal prices. It undervalues the product and none of the other teams have their provincial government backing them. Vancouver is presently the 4th highest drawing team in the league, and I'm quite sure ticket revenue is the same as what Montreal is binging in. Ticket sale revenue are all that matters in Vancouver as they don't make anything off of concessions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian B. Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Vancouver is presently the 4th highest drawing team in the league, and I'm quite sure ticket revenue is the same as what Montreal is binging in. You're right. In Montreal 80% of the people arriving at the front gate (It's more than 80% but let's be conservative) already have their tickets and I never saw anything else than $0.00 written on those tickets. The last game I went I almost awoke the girl that was selling the tickets for the Impact. She was not busy at all and the crowd was big as usual. We know one of the Impact's employee and we asked him numerous of times how many tickets are giveaways for every game and he always refused to answer thought he knows the answer. Take your own conclusions. I'm pretty sure that all their money is made with the sponsors and those sponsors are doing business with the Impact because they put so many ***** on the seats of the CCR. That proves that their stategy is succesfull. This is not a critic or an approval of the Impact's policy. All I want is that professional soccer grows in this country no matter the way we use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 Sounds like Vancouver is bringing in more revenue with tickets sales than Montreal is bringing in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snake Posted July 19, 2004 Share Posted July 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Sounds like Vancouver is bringing in more revenue with tickets sales than Montreal is bringing in. probably more than everybody. the caps make a killing on the lady caps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted July 19, 2004 Share Posted July 19, 2004 Well I was speaking strictly on the mens side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted July 19, 2004 Share Posted July 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Secondly Montreal is a non-profit organization. They can afford to sell dirt cheap tickets, and lets face it tickets that cheap are almost a giveaway. Only $5 if you are under 18, and if you are under 18 and buy a fan club pass it's only $20 for the whole year. Vancouver on the other hand is a business. Personally I don't think the Whitecaps tickets are unreasonable. I don't think other teams should follow suit, not at Montreal prices. It undervalues the product and none of the other teams have their provincial government backing them. However, the point is that their getting close to 9000 butts in the seats. Thats a success story whichever way you look at it. whether the owners are lining their pockets or not shouldn't really matter to the fans. Nor should the ownership structure or whether or not the governemnt is involved in the ownership. All that should matter is that they are financial stable and have the means to invest to improve the club. They can sign players to meet their needs with quite a bit of ease. They haven't had to sell players to meet financial needs and they have a corporate structure of suffient size to look like a pro operation. Does anyone else in Canada have that? Plus, as far as we know, none of their pay cheques have bounced. That say alot when you compare other canadian clubs ( past and present) in the soccer grave yard. Also, They cannot be financially challenged, otherwise why would they be talking about a bigger facility? someone must be making good money. With, close to 9K per game plus broadcast games on TV and radio, you are able to demand hefty $$$ ( relatively) from your sponsors. So just because they call themselves a non profit organization doesn't mean that Saputo can't give himself a raise. Same goes for the rest of the organization including the players. They have an assistant coach and I don't think the Lynx do? Do the caps have one? They can go out and pickup Ali Ngon for the playoffs or Adrian Cann to fill in for injuries. As for the Gov't. Do we know what the extent of their involvement is? I don't believe it was a direct investment. PLus why would there ever be a need to go to the gov't to bail them out these days. There is no reason to say that one organization can't be compared to another because one calls itself non profit. Most sports teams around the world don't make money either. Thats includes pro soccer in places like Italy and england. Only difference is that instead of being non profit, those teams are "NO Profit". Ultimately its the same in that they plow all most of their earnings back into the club rather than as dividends to shareholders. As for the investors, BCE, Saputo etc. They're getting visibility for their core products and services that their company's offer. So it is profitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted July 19, 2004 Share Posted July 19, 2004 Yes, but the question asked was if the Whitecaps cut ticket prices would they be able to draw as many fans as Montreal. My answer was no, because the stadium only seats 5,722 and they are averaging 4,883 so there's less than 900 seats empty per game on average. My point is that the Whitecaps are probably making as much as the Impact are (or more) on ticket sales so what benefit would there be to devalue ticket prices so that they "might" be able to fill the park. Thats the only point I was making, I was not taking a shot at the Impact, just stating the differences. As for asking what the extent of the government involvement is, a quick look at the Impact site shows that they are Corporate partners. Seems to me that they are direct partners. http://www.montrealimpact.com/partners.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted July 19, 2004 Share Posted July 19, 2004 Not comparing anything, just clarifying some amounts: I'd guess that the Impact make on average 3-4$ a head per game (so around 24,000$-32,000$ on average). This is a total guess. In 2002, the operating budget was 1.5m$. Government involvment was a total of 500,000$ over a period of 3 years (this is the last season). Big sponsors like BCE and NBC are paying circa 100,000$ per season, if I remember correctly. There has been a surplus (aka profit) in 2002 and 2003, and probably 2004. The Impact has landed in the Montreal sports market and needs to anchor itself for a long time by building its own soccer stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Boy Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Well the answer is no. Capacity at Swangard for Whitecaps games is 5,722. Any more than that and they turn you away, as happened to many unfortunate fans on opening night. Secondly Montreal is a non-profit organization. They can afford to sell dirt cheap tickets, and lets face it tickets that cheap are almost a giveaway. Only $5 if you are under 18, and if you are under 18 and buy a fan club pass it's only $20 for the whole year. Vancouver on the other hand is a business. Personally I don't think the Whitecaps tickets are unreasonable. I don't think other teams should follow suit, not at Montreal prices. It undervalues the product and none of the other teams have their provincial government backing them. Vancouver is presently the 4th highest drawing team in the league, and I'm quite sure ticket revenue is the same as what Montreal is binging in. Ticket sale revenue are all that matters in Vancouver as they don't make anything off of concessions. Forgot about the whole non-profit thing in Montreal....but what ever happend to the 6100 capacity listed on the website? It seems the capacity is getting smaller all the time. Any new news on the possible stadium behind the train station? I still believe that they should rebuild Empire Stadium, that would be just too cool. The site is still perfect for a soccer specific facility. Excelent location, easy access from highway 1, parking lot already built, major entertainment for families right next door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Boy Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Well the answer is no. Capacity at Swangard for Whitecaps games is 5,722. Any more than that and they turn you away, as happened to many unfortunate fans on opening night. Secondly Montreal is a non-profit organization. They can afford to sell dirt cheap tickets, and lets face it tickets that cheap are almost a giveaway. Only $5 if you are under 18, and if you are under 18 and buy a fan club pass it's only $20 for the whole year. Vancouver on the other hand is a business. Personally I don't think the Whitecaps tickets are unreasonable. I don't think other teams should follow suit, not at Montreal prices. It undervalues the product and none of the other teams have their provincial government backing them. Vancouver is presently the 4th highest drawing team in the league, and I'm quite sure ticket revenue is the same as what Montreal is binging in. Ticket sale revenue are all that matters in Vancouver as they don't make anything off of concessions. Forgot about the whole non-profit thing in Montreal....but what ever happend to the 6100 capacity listed on the website? It seems the capacity is getting smaller all the time. Any new news on the possible stadium behind the train station? I still believe that they should rebuild Empire Stadium, that would be just too cool. The site is still perfect for a soccer specific facility. Excelent location, easy access from highway 1, parking lot already built, major entertainment for families right next door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Danny Boy Forgot about the whole non-profit thing in Montreal....but what ever happend to the 6100 capacity listed on the website? It seems the capacity is getting smaller all the time. Any new news on the possible stadium behind the train station? I still believe that they should rebuild Empire Stadium, that would be just too cool. The site is still perfect for a soccer specific facility. Excelent location, easy access from highway 1, parking lot already built, major entertainment for families right next door. The Whitecaps have new bleachers down the east side of the stadium that they place right on the track. These bleachers have a smaller capacity than the ones behind the track-approximately 378 less seats. I'm not to up to date on the new stadium plans, so no news from me. The idea of re-building empire stadium is long gone. It's now just two playing fields as part of the whole rebuilding of the area. It won't belong until that major entertainment area right next door is all green space, as it's getting smaller and smaller all the time as they convert it into a park for the junkies and criminals to hang out in. Also the track will be gone if they vote goes against getting slots in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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