Borussia Monchengladbach want Imhof...

[TorontoInferno]

Don't know if anyone has seen this... It would be great for Daniel, hope it works out!

Foals eye Canadian

Tuesday, 20 April 2004

http://skysports.planetfootball.com/article.asp?id=197087&cpid=22

by Thomas Zeh

Bundesliga outfit Borussia Monchengladbach are eyeing a bid for St Gallen's Canadian international Daniel Imhof, according to reports in Switzerland.

Local paper Tageblatt claim the five-time German champions are keen to bring the 26-year-old defensive midfielder to Die Bundesliga as coach Holger Fach wants to strengthen his midfield options.

Imhof was born in Switzerland, but holds a Canadian passport and has already represented Canada on 23 occasions.

He is regarded as one of the most reliable footballers in the Swiss league and had been linked with a move to Cologne, where he would meet his former coach Marcel Koller.

But as Cologne are doomed to relegation, Monchengladbach seem to be in pole position to lure Imhof to Germany.

[Reza]

well, Gladbach isn't too safe either. I think they are 3 points from relegation zone.

Either way, it would be a good move, as being amongst the top Bundesliga 2 or bottom of Bundesliga is still a step up over the Swiss league IMHO.

Plus, that would make 3 Nats in Bundesliga.

[Gian-Luca]

quote:

He is regarded as one of the most reliable footballers in the Swiss league

Take that, all you Imhof bashers!! []

[Grizzly]

Some confirmation of this from Kicker as far as Cologne is concerned. The articles on Monchengladbach only stated that they were interested in Imhoff's colleague Barnetta. Even a switch to the 2nd Bundesliga would be a big improvement in playing level over Switzerland and improve his visibility to other clubs. Cologne is also the German yo-yo team. They spend 1 year in the 2nd, promote, spend 1 year in the 1st demote so he would still have good chances for playing in the 1st Bundesliga in the near future with them.

Natürlich soll der Kader auch verstärkt werden. Neben Tranquillo Barnetta und Daniel Imhof (beide St. Gallen, kicker berichtete exklusiv) ist Mathieu Delpierre (22) vom OSC Lille ein Kandidat.

[Ivan]

Yes, you got one on me there Gianluca, although I would hesitate to call myself an Imhoff "basher". I firmly believe Imhoff belongs on the 23-man MNT, just sitting beside Yallop in case of injury to DeGuzman, Aguiar, Hutchinson, or Bent.

In all seriousness, I am pleased to hear the favourable report on Imhoff. I am comfortable in stating that the scouts at Gladbach and Koln are probably better judges of pro talent than I am!

Cheers.

[Grizzly]

Some confirmation of Moenchengladbach interest as well. Interview with Imhof after 2-2 draw with Zurich in Tagblatt:

«Wir haben uns in der Pause gesagt, dass wir auf die Reaktion der Zürcher vorbereitet sein müssen. Doch wir waren es dann noch nicht. Am Ende müssen wir mit dem 2:2 zufrieden sein», sagte Daniel Imhof, an dem der deutsche Bundesligaverein Borussia Mönchengladbach Interesse bekundet.

And some talk on a German forum regarding the rumours with Cologne. Don't have time to translate but posters (who must be from Switzerland) state he is not a standout but a solid, physical defensive player who can be effective behind a more technically gifted middlefielder and that he has developed well. Some doubt as to whether he can play in the 1st Bundesliga but seem to think he should be at least good enough for the 2nd Bundesliga and may possibly be a surprise.

Zoke (77 Beiträge) Tue 13.04.2004 - 10:39

"Daniel Imhof"

Sorry, ich war bis jetzt noch nicht hier und weiss nicht, ob das hier das richtige Forum ist, aber ich hätte gerne einige Informationen zu Daniel Imhof, da er wohl das Interesse des 1. FC Köln geweckt haben soll. Das, was bei tm.de steht ist mir etwas zu wenig und ich hoffe nun auf Berichte von Leuten, die etwas näher dran sind.

vielen Dank schonmal im Vorraus.

Stefan

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Antworten zu diesem Thema

Kampfsau (1271 Beiträge) Wed 14.04.2004 - 07:20

"RE: Daniel Imhof"

Naja, ich weiss nicht so recht. Ist ein unauffälliger Spieler, hat sich gut entwickelt. Spielt defensives Mittelfeld und ist eine Arbeitsbiene! Bei ihm finde ich es unsicher, ob er den Sprung schaffen kann. Für die 2. Buli könnte es auf jeden Fall reichen.

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mega eggi (128 Beiträge) Wed 14.04.2004 - 07:27

"RE: Daniel Imhof"

imhof nach köln? na ja ich weiss nicht. ok, koller hatte in der vergangenheit meist recht, wenn er einen spieler nachholte oder nachholen wollte. zuerst mit jairo und amoah von wil zum fcsg, die beiden schlugen ein wie bomben, und der fcsg wurde schweizermeister. danach wollte er stil zu gc holen, was scheiterte, weil gc ihn nicht wollte, stil ist immerhin natigoali und in der bundelige mehr oder weniger unumstritten (seit neustem auch wieder ganz gut).

koller weiss auf alle fälle, was die leute können. imhof ist nicht mehr ganz jung, und somit sicher nicht allzuteuer. imhof hat seine vozüge in der funktion als scheibenwischer hinter einem kreativen mittelfeldspieler. er ist ein eifriger renner und kein grosser techniker, mehr ein biederer handwerker aber eigentlich solid.

für meinen teil zweifle ich daran, ob imhof wirklich der richtige für den fc ist. aber man kann sich überraschen lassen, ob er den durchbruch schaffen kann... für ein top team reichts nicht, aber für die 2. liga...? warum nicht?

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Kampfsau (1271 Beiträge) Wed 14.04.2004 - 09:42

"RE: Daniel Imhof"

>imhof ist nicht mehr ganz jung,

?!?!?!?!?! Imhof ist erst 26!

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[mattbin]

Sounds about right. Imhof proved how good he can look when hooking up with the right attacker in his first two Canadian caps. We (well, okay, I) were (was) predicting great things for him then. The Confed took the wind out of a lot of our (my) sails, but we (I) still think he has something to give to Canada, especially when we're thin with two-way options in the back and mid (less so in mid of course).

Did I mention how I predicted great things for Hume? Because that's totally worked out for me. I do have cred. Honest. On that note, though, best of luck, Daniel. Here's hoping for a Bundesliga spot and promotion next year if necessary.

Incidentally, what do you guys think has led to our recent Canuck success in the Bundesliga? Stalteri and DeGu don't have a lot in common as far as their strengths go. Are Canucks just a cheap option for German teams, or what?

Allez les Rouges,

M@

[Guest Ed]

quote:Originally posted by mattbin

Incidentally, what do you guys think has led to our recent Canuck success in the Bundesliga? Stalteri and DeGu don't have a lot in common as far as their strengths go. Are Canucks just a cheap option for German teams, or what?

Allez les Rouges,

M@

The success of Hargreaves has a lot to do with it, with the younger players anyway. North America is now seen in Germany as a huge potential player pool. And the most successful Canucks, Stalteri and de Guzman, are serious pro players. They don't qualify for the beer leagues and have to work really hard day in day out for their spots.

[Grizzly]

The success of Hargreaves had nothing to do with the success of Stalteri, DeGuzman and Nsaliwa, the only current Bundesliga players, nor will it have anything to do with the possible signing of Imhof. Hargreave's success might have had some influence on the recent signings of youth players but no more than the above named players and McKenna (who netted Energie Cottbus about $750 000 in transfer fee which was a good return on investment). In fact, most Germans think Hargreave's is English. Mention Canadian soccer players to any German and they will say Stalteri and DeGuzman, both of whom are every bit as prominent and successful players despite playing for less storied clubs. German clubs have been signing Canadians for quite a while and long before Hargreaves, Bent for example. As I have said before, this is because Germany is the poor sister of the big four leagues and thus works harder finding cheap sources of talent. Eventually a few of these signings paid off and obviously the more Canadian players who are successful the more German clubs will look at other young Canadians. As much as you deny it, Ed, Stalteri and DeGuzman have done far more for Canadian soccer by being successful players and representing their country than Hargreaves has by being a successful player and turning his back on his country.

[Guest Ed]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

The success of Hargreaves had nothing to do with the success of Stalteri, DeGuzman and Nsaliwa, the only current Bundesliga players, nor will it have anything to do with the possible signing of Imhof. Hargreave's success might have had some influence on the recent signings of youth players but no more than the above named players and McKenna (who netted Energie Cottbus about $750 000 in transfer fee which was a good return on investment). In fact, most Germans think Hargreave's is English. Mention Canadian soccer players to any German and they will say Stalteri and DeGuzman, both of whom are every bit as prominent and successful players despite playing for less storied clubs. German clubs have been signing Canadians for quite a while and long before Hargreaves, Bent for example. As I have said before, this is because Germany is the poor sister of the big four leagues and thus works harder finding cheap sources of talent. Eventually a few of these signings paid off and obviously the more Canadian players who are successful the more German clubs will look at other young Canadians. As much as you deny it, Ed, Stalteri and DeGuzman have done far more for Canadian soccer by being successful players and representing their country than Hargreaves has by being a successful player and turning his back on his country.

Really there is little point in debating with you as your hatred of Hargreaves leaves your logic more than a little fuzzy, but here's the deal.

1. "The success of Hargreaves had nothing to do with the success of Stalteri, de Guzman and Nsaliwa." That is correct. Their success is soley down to their own efforts. However, the fact that Nsaliwa got a trial in the first place was directly related to the success that Hargreaves had at Bayern. The same can be said for Ledgerwood.

2. The fact that most Germans think that Hargreaves is English means diddly squat. The German coaches who have taken on Cdns for trials at Nurnberg, 1860 and Kaiserslautern definitely know he is a Cdn from Calgary, trained by a certain German expat.

3. "German clubs have been signing Canadians for quite a while and long before Hargreaves, Bent for example." Bent and de Rosario were signed by some crap former East German side and did not exactly set the Bundesliga 2 on fire. Not exactly Bayern Munich. Can you add to that list? I think not.

4. And I do nothing but support the two Cdn players de Guzman and Stalteri, but to say they have done more for Cdn soccer by being successful players and representing their country is just pure malarky. I was supporting Stalteri for a couple of years when he was ridiculed on Cdn soccer boards. And Julian has not been given a fair chance to represent his country yet and is only now being recognized in Canada and Germany as a potentially great player. He had some local fans in Saarbrucken but has only emerged this year as a real pro. Hargreaves was and is in the spotlight and has been for a few years. A massive club, known world-wide, great performances in the Champions League, playing for an established European power. To say he has not raised interest in Cdn players is not logical, it's just denial.

[The Beaver]

Ed, I think you are rather overstating Hargreaves importance here. Yes, I agree that it is pure denial to say he's not had "some" impact, but the fairly recent interest the Bundesliga is showing in North American players has a helluva lot more to do with the emergence of the US as a credible soccer nation (near credible) than Hargreaves' arrival on the Bunde-scene.

[Guest Ed]

quote:Originally posted by The Beaver

Ed, I think you are rather overstating Hargreaves importance here. Yes, I agree that it is pure denial to say he's not had "some" impact, but the fairly recent interest the Bundesliga is showing in North American players has a helluva lot more to do with the emergence of the US as a credible soccer nation (near credible) than Hargreaves' arrival on the Bunde-scene.

I agree that there is currently big interest in North American players; the showing by the USA against Germany in the WC was noticed big time. But in the case of Cdn players, and the specific players mentioned, I stand by what I said. What reasons do you put forward for the fact that more Canadians are getting a look in the Bundesliga?

Please read my post again, as it was in response to Grizzly's reactive diatribe against Hargreaves. I would like to add that de Guzman and Stalteri both work hard themselves at promoting Cdn players as much as they can in Germany, although it doesn't make the headlines back home.

[Gordon]

I think it fair to say that the success of Hargreaves is a factor, just as the emergence of first Stalteri and now DeGuzman will provide added impetus and evidence that Hargreaves is not simply an aberation. Is it the whole reason? No. But it is part of the equation. Hargreaves is doing the least possible to benefit soccer in Canada given his talent and opportunity. But that does not mean he hasn't been of some benefit. Playing for England doesn't change the fact that he was born, raised, and partially trained in Canada.

[Free kick]

The timing of this announcement interestingly coincides with the story on another thread regarding the release of Elliott Godfrey. Once again, more proof that Canadians seem to be more welcomed as soccer players in Germany than in England. One can go on and on with examples to show how Canucks are progressing in Germany and falling back in the UK. Some of the explanations mentioned sound reasonable; 1) existing canuck in those leagues have blazed a trail for others 2) economic factors affecting professional soccer in germany force the German clubs to be more agressive and innovative in their recruiting practises. 3) english bias toeward canaucks and 4) The fifa ranking rule which applies to foreigners in the UK.

But how about this as a theory. Might the way canadians are developed mean that they are more suited to the German game rather than the game in the British Iles?

[Grizzly]

I completely agree with Gordon's post. If you read my post, I didn't deny that Hargreaves has some influence but you are vastly overestimating the importance. If anyone asks someone knowledgeable about German soccer why there are 3-4 (depending on your opinion) Canadians having success in the Bundesliga (which was Mattbin's question not why there are Canadians in the Junior Bundesliga or Reserve teams) only an apologist for Hargreaves would come up with him as the main answer. He plays for a more prominent club than Stalteri and DeGuz but is not a more prominent player than the others. When Stalteri is playing in the Champion's League next year and the announcers are saying "Canadian International Paul Stalteri" to a worldwide audience this will do far more for Canadian soccer than Hargreaves has ever done just as currently happens in Bundesliga broadcasts. How did Hargreaves get Nsaliwa a trial in Germany when Nsaliwa was already playing there before Hargreaves had even played a Bundesliga game? The pre-Hargreaves list of players in Germany would include Stalteri, Nsaliwa, McKenna, Hirschfeld, Bent, DeRosario with DeGuzman coming to Germany from a large French club so it is not like signing Canadian players is a post-Hargreaves phenomenom. In fact, Bayern has not signed another Canadian since while Bremen signed Canizales probably due to Stalteri and Saarbrucken signed Oppong after having Nsaliwa and DeGuzman. I would give Niendorf some credit but excuse me if I am not overly impressed with Hargreaves contribution. As far as your insulting and baiting comments regarding me, I do not like Hargreaves but I don't hate him either. I don't feel it is worthwhile responding to your personal attacks. I used to enjoy reading your posts because they were informative and you seem to have some inside information. However, you are increasingly including personal insults and baiting and becoming more and more like a troll. It doesn't bother me if you or anyone else supports Hargreaves playing for England and I am willing to debate our views in a fair and respectful manner. If you can not do similarly than refrain from posting on such threads and stick to your informative posts. I am sure I am not the only one here who would appreciate that. You seem to get a kick out of pissing people off but I am not interested in coming on the board to get pissed off and will only react to the informative and debateable parts of your posts.

[Gian-Luca]

quote:Originally posted by Free kick

The timing of this announcement interestingly coincides with the story on another thread regarding the release of Elliott Godfrey. Once again, more proof that Canadians seem to be more welcomed as soccer players in Germany than in England.

I wouldn't use Godfrey as an example in this instance. He moved to England at the age of 6 and learned the game there.

[Guest Ed]

You can't have it both ways. You ask to be treated in a fair and respectful manner, but certainly show no such courtesy towards a young Canadian player. Perhaps if several coaches at the CSA and people like yourself were a little more respectful of Cdn players abroad, we'd all be celebrating Hargreave's success at Bayern and with Canada.

BTW, you might want to read my post again, as I never said that Hargreaves personally had helped get Cdns to Germany. I said that Hargreaves success had a lot to do with it. And his 'success' was apparent well before his Bundesliga debut. Please don't offer me any history lessons on Canadians playing in Germany. You've got your facts wrong in a number of areas, but heaven forbid I should point them out as that would be labelled a personal attack. I don't get a kick out of pissing people off so much as I need to answer posts which piss me off. You seem to think that having lived in Germany offers you some kind of divine right to dismiss any opinion on German football events that doesn't agree with yours. You do that and you'll sometimes get an argument from me.

[Grizzly]

When have I shown Hargreaves disrespect? I said he turned his back on his country but how can you deny this? In my opinion anyone without a strong tie to another country who chooses not to represent Canada is not a good Canadian. Hargreaves did this and I am pointing this out, this is not disrespect but pointing out a fact. You certainly have the right to disagree about my defintion of a good Canadian and I have no problem with you posting such views. I actually do not have respect for him but I don't go on the forum personally insulting him or saying he is an awful human being. He chose not to play for Canada and the consequences are that he is not popular with most Canadian soccer fans (at least the ones I know). I have never denigrated his abilities and although I don't consider him the superstar that you do he is still a very good player and an obvious starter on our MNT. We have been through the supposed snub of Hargreaves a thousand times before and I don't buy it one bit. And if you think that clubs were lining up to sign Canadians because Hargreaves did well in the Bayern junior and reserve teams you are dreaming, he became a factor after his Champion's League debut. If I have any factual errors in a post then point them out, that is certainly not a personal attack. Where have I ever acted like I have a divine right to dismiss other opinions on German football? You should provide some examples instead of blind accusations. I am in fact German-born as well as having lived there but this does not give me any divine right either nor have I ever had that attitude. In fact, even though we disagree on some fundamental questions I think you do know a lot about German football. I certainly don't remember ever referring to any of your posts as a reactive diatribe, saying that you have fuzzy logic nor have I tried to distort your opinions such as you did in trying to claim that I approve of the Khadrs on the thread in the other form. In addition, I am extremely supportive and respectful of every Canadian player who chooses to pull on the red and white. I don't like the amount of disrespect shown to Hastings and Fenwick by some on this board for example. Not that I think they should be called for the MNT but I give them credit for showing up every time they are called and while it is ok to criticize their play some posters get pretty insulting towards them. Nor was I one of the anti-Stalteri gang during his first few years with the MNT. So if you have any evidence of me disrespecting Hargreaves, a Canadian MNT player, you or any other poster please present it.

[An Observer]

I personally believe Hargreaves is a traitor and sell out for not playing for Canada but completely agree with Ed's analysis of his impact on opening doors for Canadian soccer players. Not to say others haven't had influence but his is surely the biggest in Germany.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca

I wouldn't use Godfrey as an example in this instance. He moved to England at the age of 6 and learned the game there.

Perhaps but since the time that Bircham decided to represent canada, he has not progressed much either. When you think about it, the only Canadian in the EPL currently got there through Belgium and again by playing outside the UK he managed to progress from the likes of North york rockets to Germinal Ekeren to Anderlecht. Would he have faced the same fate had he chosen the UK route rather than the continent. There are other examples such as Jazic and Klukowski who have not gone to Germany to pursue a pro career and have also progressed. So it doesn't seem to be limited to Germany. But those who have gone to the UK have gone nowhere. Occasionally, one moves up a level but its only because their club was promoted. I am not a big Pesch booster nowadays, but I have to wonder where he would have ended up had he taken a different route. Mind you, You can be certain that he has no regrets.

I don't have stats to back it up , but it would appear that carribean players have fared better in England than Canadians or americans

[Gian-Luca]

Many of those Carribbean players (if you are thinkin of Jamaicans) have probably never been to the Carribean - many are really English players of Jamaican descent, eligible to play for Canada.

Radz isn't the only Canadian in the EPL, there's Hirshfeld and next season Jim Brennan, and possibly De Vos. I think Bircham hasn't progressed that much not because he chose to represent Canada (or when he temporarily stopped doing so) but because he simply isn't of a high enough quality to be playing regularly in the EPL.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca

Many of those Carribbean players (if you are thinkin of Jamaicans) have probably never been to the Carribean - many are really English players of Jamaican descent, eligible to play for Canada.

Radz isn't the only Canadian in the EPL, there's Hirshfeld and next season Jim Brennan, and possibly De Vos. I think Bircham hasn't progressed that much not because he chose to represent Canada (or when he temporarily stopped doing so) but because he simply isn't of a high enough quality to be playing regularly in the EPL.

I was thinking of not only of Jamaicans but also trinidadians and also someone like Shawn Goater ( although I know that bermuda is not in the Carribean). They have progressed far better than the Canucks in UK. What I was saying is that the only way canucks have advanced in the UK is through club promotion therefore your example of devos and Brennan would once again, prove my point.

How can one explain the situation of Jim Brennan last summer? he's out there on the transfer market having played for a side that had just competed in the promotion playoff. He was a regular on that side which would suggest that his quality level has to be comparable or competive with similar lower EPL sides. Yet where was the interest from the EPL sides? I watched Everton quite closely this year when they were on TV and I have had a hard time seeing how the MF's and D's on that club are substantially better than what I have seen of Brennan in MNT colours. But where does the interest come from? Norwich, a similar side to what NF was last year.

As far as Hirshfeld. He hasn't really progressed has he? I seem to recall something along the line of :third string to reserves, back to third string, loan out to Luton, back to reserves etc etc. I read no indication that he is being seriously considered for 1st action anytime soon. I don't call that progression.

[Free kick]

To be clear, here is what I mean by professional progression:

1) Toronto Lynx to Werder Bremen reserves to Werder Bremnen senior side to Bundesliga Champs.

2) Scarborough youth soccer to Olympic Marseille youth side to saarbrucken reserves to saabrucken senior to Hannover 96 ( Bundesliga)

3) North york Rockets to germinal Ekeren to Anderlecht to Everton

4) Oshawa to Lille Youth side to Lalouviere ( Belgium first)

5) Halifax to Split Croatia reserves to senior team to Rapid Vienna.

The above are examples of what we saw of young canucks who have went to Europe. there are many more similar examples.

What i don't call progression is:

1) Birmingham to Fulham to fulham reserves to sheffield to Derby county. I am sure I missd some here but you can see they are all 2nd or third tier level.

2) Manchester city reserves to 4th tier

3) NF to Norwich

4) Dundee Utd ( SPL) to Wigan ( Eng 2nd)

5) Colorado to plymouth to ????

6) Calgary to Energie Cottbus reserves to senior team to SPL and currently still in SPL.

the a latter are examples of players who have gone to the UK or been transferred there. As you can see they have stalled or were progressing prior to ending up in the UK but have stalled since. Again, Off hand I cannot think of any Canuck who has progressed in British soccer. Hume will present a true test this summer. If he is still at Tranmere next summer, then the CSA and cnd soccer agents might have something to think about.

[Gordon]

No disrespect, but I think that the players in question are at best borderline EPL players. There are real questions about DeVos's quickness, I am not so sure that he can play regularly or effectively in the EPL. But would note that he was picked up by Wigan in the Second Division as part of a goal of getting into the EPL. So that is in effect a progression. As for Brennan, I was a bit surprised he didn't get picked up by a lower EPL team on the free. But none of the Div 1 teams going up felt that he should be picked up and they would have seen the most of him. It may be that Div 1 is his level. The notion that teams woud ignore quality players simply because of their nationality is one that only conspiracy theorist accept. Lars, for example, went from the A-League to the EPL. He has a lot to learn about keeping goal. And from recent performances, it seems he is indeed learning and quickly.

[Gordon]

No disrespect, but I think that the players in question are at best borderline EPL players. There are real questions about DeVos's quickness, I am not so sure that he can play regularly or effectively in the EPL. But would note that he was picked up by Wigan in the Second Division as part of a goal of getting into the EPL. So that is in effect a progression. As for Brennan, I was a bit surprised he didn't get picked up by a lower EPL team on the free. But none of the Div 1 teams going up felt that he should be picked up and they would have seen the most of him. It may be that Div 1 is his level. The notion that teams woud ignore quality players simply because of their nationality is one that only conspiracy theorist accept. Lars, for example, went from the A-League to the EPL. He has a lot to learn about keeping goal. And from recent performances, it seems he is indeed learning and quickly.